Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Bill · 06-08-2002, 07:35 PM

I would appreciate any comments from the folks here, some of whom are among the most knowledgable folks on Earth when it comes to the evolution/creation debate. Please read and respond to <a href="http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/bill_schultz/ID-not.html" target="_blank">MY NEW ESSAY</a> here on the Secular Web. Thanks in advance,

== Bill

SecularProLifer · 06-10-2002, 03:58 AM

Interestingly, the possibility of a flawed designer, one capable of making mistakes, can't be ruled out.

scigirl · 06-10-2002, 01:14 PM

Bill,

I am in the process of reading/reviewing the article. I like it (I was in the middle of it when my mom showed up!) - I sent you a private message, but I'll probably send you another one once I get a chance to read it again.

scigirl

Dr.GH · 06-10-2002, 02:14 PM

You might want to include links to:

Paul R. Renne
2002 Enhanced: Flood Basalts--Bigger and Badder
Science 296:1812-1813

and

Marc K. Reichow, Andrew D. Saunders, Rosalind V. White, Malcolm S. Pringle, Alexander I. Al'Mukhamedov, Alexander I. Medvedev, and Nikolay P. Kirda
2002 "40Ar/39Ar Dates from the West Siberian Basin: Siberian Flood Basalt Province Doubled"
Science 296: 1846-1849.

which mark a probable cause of the Permo-Triassic transition.

A good book reference is The Fossil Trail: How we know what we think we know about human evolution by Ian Tattersall, 1995: Oxford University Press

[ June 10, 2002: Message edited by: Dr.GH ]</p>

lpetrich · 06-10-2002, 03:01 PM

That recent Science issue also mentioned a third big flood-basalt event, the Central Atlantic Magmatic Province (CAMP), from 200 million years ago, parts of which can be found in eastern North America, northeastern South America, western Africa, and western Europe. Back then, those continents were parts of a single continent, Pangaea.

There are some interesting associations of flood basalts with mass extinctions:

Siberia - Permian/Triassic
CAMP - Triassic/Jurassic
Deccan Traps - Cretaceous/Tertiary (K/T)

The K/T mass extinction is also associated with the Chicxulub meteorite strike; that strike could have caused the Deccan Traps by its earthquake waves being focused at the strike's antipode. This focusing would cause a lot of cracks, which would then let a lot of deep-Earth lava escape.

Antipodal-effect terrain is known on the Moon and Mercury, so they could also have happened here on Earth. Courtesy of <a href="http://www.scotese.com" target="_blank">http://www.scotese.com</a> I can find the reconstructed antipode positions:

Permian/Triassic -- a little to the west of the southern tips of South America and Africa, then parts of Gondwana (probably subducted).

Triassic/Jurassic -- a little to the east of southeast Asia (probably subducted).

Cretaceous/Tertiary -- the antipode of the Chicxulub crater is a little to the east of southern India, the location of the Deccan Traps.

The next question is whether there are any big flood basalts associated with some other mass extinctions, such as

Neogene (6 "extinction pulses")
Late Oligocene
Late Devonian
Late Ordovician
Late Cambrian (3)
Early Cambrian
End of Vendian
Beginning of Vendian

From <a href="http://hannover.park.org/Canada/Museum/extinction/tablecont.html" target="_blank">this page on mass extinctions</a>.

06-08-2002, 07:35 PM	#1
Bill Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Gatorville, Florida Posts: 4,334	Were Humans Intelligently Designed? Science Says No! I would appreciate any comments from the folks here, some of whom are among the most knowledgable folks on Earth when it comes to the evolution/creation debate. Please read and respond to <a href="http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/bill_schultz/ID-not.html" target="_blank">MY NEW ESSAY</a> here on the Secular Web. Thanks in advance, == Bill

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06-10-2002, 03:58 AM	#2
SecularProLifer New Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Riverside, CA Posts: 1	Interestingly, the possibility of a flawed designer, one capable of making mistakes, can't be ruled out.

06-10-2002, 01:14 PM	#3
scigirl Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Seattle Posts: 4,261	Bill, I am in the process of reading/reviewing the article. I like it (I was in the middle of it when my mom showed up!) - I sent you a private message, but I'll probably send you another one once I get a chance to read it again. scigirl

06-10-2002, 02:14 PM	#4
Dr.GH Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Dana Point, Ca, USA Posts: 2,115	You might want to include links to: Paul R. Renne 2002 Enhanced: Flood Basalts--Bigger and Badder Science 296:1812-1813 and Marc K. Reichow, Andrew D. Saunders, Rosalind V. White, Malcolm S. Pringle, Alexander I. Al'Mukhamedov, Alexander I. Medvedev, and Nikolay P. Kirda 2002 "40Ar/39Ar Dates from the West Siberian Basin: Siberian Flood Basalt Province Doubled" Science 296: 1846-1849. which mark a probable cause of the Permo-Triassic transition. A good book reference is The Fossil Trail: How we know what we think we know about human evolution by Ian Tattersall, 1995: Oxford University Press [ June 10, 2002: Message edited by: Dr.GH ]</p>

06-10-2002, 03:01 PM	#5
lpetrich Contributor Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Lebanon, OR, USA Posts: 16,829	That recent Science issue also mentioned a third big flood-basalt event, the Central Atlantic Magmatic Province (CAMP), from 200 million years ago, parts of which can be found in eastern North America, northeastern South America, western Africa, and western Europe. Back then, those continents were parts of a single continent, Pangaea. There are some interesting associations of flood basalts with mass extinctions: Siberia - Permian/Triassic CAMP - Triassic/Jurassic Deccan Traps - Cretaceous/Tertiary (K/T) The K/T mass extinction is also associated with the Chicxulub meteorite strike; that strike could have caused the Deccan Traps by its earthquake waves being focused at the strike's antipode. This focusing would cause a lot of cracks, which would then let a lot of deep-Earth lava escape. Antipodal-effect terrain is known on the Moon and Mercury, so they could also have happened here on Earth. Courtesy of <a href="http://www.scotese.com" target="_blank">http://www.scotese.com</a> I can find the reconstructed antipode positions: Permian/Triassic -- a little to the west of the southern tips of South America and Africa, then parts of Gondwana (probably subducted). Triassic/Jurassic -- a little to the east of southeast Asia (probably subducted). Cretaceous/Tertiary -- the antipode of the Chicxulub crater is a little to the east of southern India, the location of the Deccan Traps. The next question is whether there are any big flood basalts associated with some other mass extinctions, such as Neogene (6 "extinction pulses") Late Oligocene Late Devonian Late Ordovician Late Cambrian (3) Early Cambrian End of Vendian Beginning of Vendian From <a href="http://hannover.park.org/Canada/Museum/extinction/tablecont.html" target="_blank">this page on mass extinctions</a>.

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