Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Lobstrosity · 05-14-2003, 03:43 PM

I was wondering if any Great Flood proponents or perhaps people who have extensive experience debating Great Flood proponents could tell me how our esteemed Young-Earth Creation scientist collegues answer the following minor questions:

1) By what process did Noah gather all of his animals in the first place? For example, how did he first find the Elephants, then subdue them, then transport them back to his Ark? Did the tigers and crocodiles give him any problems? How long was this animal-gathering phase thought to have taken?

2) What steps did Noah take to save the plants and fish?

3) What did Noah and the animals eat while aboard the Ark?

4) What did the animals eat in the months and years immediately following the recession of the floodwaters?

5) What percentage of the "kinds" Noah saved are thought to have gone extinct due to their inability to bounce back from such severe population depletion?

6) How did the animals get redistributed around the world? Did Noah take them all back? How long was this thought to have taken?

7)
a. At what point in our history did Noah's descendants go to Africa and turn black? What caused them to forget all about Noah's God?
b. At what point in our history did Noah's descendants go to Asia and turn Asian? Why did they forget about Noah's God?
c. At what point in our history did Noah's descendants make it to the Americas? How did they get there?

8) What was the point of the great flood? Given the current state of the world, can it be said that the flood actually accomplished anything beyond lots of gratuitous killing?

I'm not trying to preach to to the choir with this post, I'm trying to figure out the rationale of people who view the great flood as physically plausible.

Doubting Didymus · 05-14-2003, 04:25 PM

Quote:

a. At what point in our history did Noah's ancestors go to Africa and turn black? What caused them to forget all about Noah's God?
b. At what point in our history did Noah's ancestors go to Asia and turn Asian? Why did they forget about Noah's God?
c. At what point in our history did Noah's ancestors make it to the Americas? How did they get there?

I think you might mean Noah's descendants? Noahs ancestors and their other relatives didn't do anything much except scream "Help me Noah! Have mercy! I'm more important that a stupid termite colony! Bubble bubble bubble!"

Arikay · 05-14-2003, 04:37 PM

Sure, ive debated against the flood enough, ill try to answer them.

"1) By what process did Noah gather all of his animals in the first place? For example, how did he first find the Elephants, then subdue them, then transport them back to his Ark? Did the tigers and crocodiles give him any problems? How long was this animal-gathering phase thought to have taken?"

God somehow magically called all the animals to the ark for noah. Common answers is that God either transported them to the ark, or the earth was in a pangea form and so they walked there.

"2) What steps did Noah take to save the plants and fish? "

he didnt. Apparently fish and plants could have survived the flood.
How? I dont know, never gotten them to explain that. Especially since the bible does say that all the animals were killed (Gen 7:4) and (Gen 7:23) and (gen 6:17). But that verse in interpreted by them to say that only land animals were killed (even though at the very least, the whale should be classified as having the "breath of life" in it.).

"3) What did Noah and the animals eat while aboard the Ark? "

Food that noah took onto the ark. Never gotten a good explination. Some claim that all the animals were put into a hybernation slumber. But never explain how things with a quick life cycle survived or where the bible says this hybernation happend.

"4) What did the animals eat in the months and years immediately following the recession of the floodwaters? "

Another question ive never been given a good answer for. Quite often its said that they ate the plants that survived.

"5) What percentage of the "kinds" Noah saved are thought to have gone extinct due to their inability to bounce back from such severe population depletion? "

Interesting question.

"6) How did the animals get redistributed around the world? Did Noah take them all back? How long was this thought to have taken?"

Never had a good answer for this either. (I see a trend forming.

) some say that they swam back to where they lived. Others just say god took them back, and others ignore the question.

"7)
a. At what point in our history did Noah's ancestors go to Africa and turn black? What caused them to forget all about Noah's God?
b. At what point in our history did Noah's ancestors go to Asia and turn Asian? Why did they forget about Noah's God?
c. At what point in our history did Noah's ancestors make it to the Americas? How did they get there? "

Good question, never asked it before.

"8) What was the point of the great flood? Given the current state of the world, can it be said that the flood actually accomplished anything beyond lots of gratuitous killing? "

The point was to punish the evil humans.

God in his infinite wisdom either failed to realize it wouldnt stop evil nor kill off the giants, or he did realize it and just did it to kill things.

Not much help, but then its often frustrating to debate people who believe in a literal flood.

EvolvEarth · 05-14-2003, 04:56 PM

God let the flood happen because of the imperfections of man and then said that he no longer would do that to the earth because of the imperfections of man. Basically, God realized what he did was a mistake.

Lobstrosity · 05-14-2003, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Doubting Didymus
I think you might mean Noah's descendants? Noahs ancestors and their other relatives didn't do anything much except scream "Help me Noah! Have mercy! I'm more important that a stupid termite colony! Bubble bubble bubble!"

Damnit! I hate when language fails me.

Spaz · 05-14-2003, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lobstrosity
7)
a. At what point in our history did Noah's descendants go to Africa and turn black? What caused them to forget all about Noah's God?
b. At what point in our history did Noah's descendants go to Asia and turn Asian? Why did they forget about Noah's God?
c. At what point in our history did Noah's descendants make it to the Americas? How did they get there?

That has to be the best thing I've heard to refute the flood, I never thought about that. :notworthy :notworthy

Doubting Didymus · 05-14-2003, 05:14 PM

I think there are answers to the noahs descendants questions, though I only know the one about africa.

You all remember Ham, the poor sap who caught his father pissed out of his brain and dead starkers? Well, its been suggested that when he was exiled and cursed with slavery, he...

Here I pause, to consider how stupid this next line will sound.

Right, so he was exiled and his descendants cursed with slavery, so he... Went to africa and turned black.

Spaz · 05-14-2003, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Doubting Didymus
I think there are answers to the noahs descendants questions, though I only know the one about africa.

You all remember Ham, the poor sap who caught his father pissed out of his brain and dead starkers? Well, its been suggested that when he was exiled and cursed with slavery, he...

Here I pause, to consider how stupid this next line will sound.

Right, so he was exiled and his descendants cursed with slavery, so he... Went to africa and turned black.

Wow, somebody really said that? I'm sorry.

Arikay · 05-14-2003, 05:29 PM

And yet evolutionists are called racist

trillian · 05-14-2003, 06:27 PM

About the "race" thing..

I have heard an argument which says that each of Noah's sons represents a race. Black, White, and Asian. They dispersed after the flood and became races we see today. Funny stuff, huh?

Never heard what they thought about Incans, mayans, or native americans though????

05-14-2003, 03:43 PM	#1
Lobstrosity Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: San Diego, California Posts: 719	Questions about the flood I was wondering if any Great Flood proponents or perhaps people who have extensive experience debating Great Flood proponents could tell me how our esteemed Young-Earth Creation scientist collegues answer the following minor questions: 1) By what process did Noah gather all of his animals in the first place? For example, how did he first find the Elephants, then subdue them, then transport them back to his Ark? Did the tigers and crocodiles give him any problems? How long was this animal-gathering phase thought to have taken? 2) What steps did Noah take to save the plants and fish? 3) What did Noah and the animals eat while aboard the Ark? 4) What did the animals eat in the months and years immediately following the recession of the floodwaters? 5) What percentage of the "kinds" Noah saved are thought to have gone extinct due to their inability to bounce back from such severe population depletion? 6) How did the animals get redistributed around the world? Did Noah take them all back? How long was this thought to have taken? 7) a. At what point in our history did Noah's descendants go to Africa and turn black? What caused them to forget all about Noah's God? b. At what point in our history did Noah's descendants go to Asia and turn Asian? Why did they forget about Noah's God? c. At what point in our history did Noah's descendants make it to the Americas? How did they get there? 8) What was the point of the great flood? Given the current state of the world, can it be said that the flood actually accomplished anything beyond lots of gratuitous killing? I'm not trying to preach to to the choir with this post, I'm trying to figure out the rationale of people who view the great flood as physically plausible.

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05-14-2003, 04:37 PM	#3
Arikay Regular Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Ca, Usa Posts: 262	Sure, ive debated against the flood enough, ill try to answer them. "1) By what process did Noah gather all of his animals in the first place? For example, how did he first find the Elephants, then subdue them, then transport them back to his Ark? Did the tigers and crocodiles give him any problems? How long was this animal-gathering phase thought to have taken?" God somehow magically called all the animals to the ark for noah. Common answers is that God either transported them to the ark, or the earth was in a pangea form and so they walked there. "2) What steps did Noah take to save the plants and fish? " he didnt. Apparently fish and plants could have survived the flood. How? I dont know, never gotten them to explain that. Especially since the bible does say that all the animals were killed (Gen 7:4) and (Gen 7:23) and (gen 6:17). But that verse in interpreted by them to say that only land animals were killed (even though at the very least, the whale should be classified as having the "breath of life" in it.). "3) What did Noah and the animals eat while aboard the Ark? " Food that noah took onto the ark. Never gotten a good explination. Some claim that all the animals were put into a hybernation slumber. But never explain how things with a quick life cycle survived or where the bible says this hybernation happend. "4) What did the animals eat in the months and years immediately following the recession of the floodwaters? " Another question ive never been given a good answer for. Quite often its said that they ate the plants that survived. "5) What percentage of the "kinds" Noah saved are thought to have gone extinct due to their inability to bounce back from such severe population depletion? " Interesting question. "6) How did the animals get redistributed around the world? Did Noah take them all back? How long was this thought to have taken?" Never had a good answer for this either. (I see a trend forming. ) some say that they swam back to where they lived. Others just say god took them back, and others ignore the question. "7) a. At what point in our history did Noah's ancestors go to Africa and turn black? What caused them to forget all about Noah's God? b. At what point in our history did Noah's ancestors go to Asia and turn Asian? Why did they forget about Noah's God? c. At what point in our history did Noah's ancestors make it to the Americas? How did they get there? " Good question, never asked it before. "8) What was the point of the great flood? Given the current state of the world, can it be said that the flood actually accomplished anything beyond lots of gratuitous killing? " The point was to punish the evil humans. God in his infinite wisdom either failed to realize it wouldnt stop evil nor kill off the giants, or he did realize it and just did it to kill things. Not much help, but then its often frustrating to debate people who believe in a literal flood.

05-14-2003, 04:56 PM	#4
EvolvEarth Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Florida Posts: 90	God let the flood happen because of the imperfections of man and then said that he no longer would do that to the earth because of the imperfections of man. Basically, God realized what he did was a mistake.

05-14-2003, 05:14 PM	#7
Doubting Didymus Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: East Coast. Australia. Posts: 5,455	I think there are answers to the noahs descendants questions, though I only know the one about africa. You all remember Ham, the poor sap who caught his father pissed out of his brain and dead starkers? Well, its been suggested that when he was exiled and cursed with slavery, he... Here I pause, to consider how stupid this next line will sound. Right, so he was exiled and his descendants cursed with slavery, so he... Went to africa and turned black.

05-14-2003, 05:29 PM	#9
Arikay Regular Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Ca, Usa Posts: 262	And yet evolutionists are called racist

05-14-2003, 06:27 PM	#10
trillian Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: OC Posts: 1,620	About the "race" thing.. I have heard an argument which says that each of Noah's sons represents a race. Black, White, and Asian. They dispersed after the flood and became races we see today. Funny stuff, huh? Never heard what they thought about Incans, mayans, or native americans though????

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