bonduca

Under the normal circumstances of daily life, don't all living things generally seek to avoid dying, and continue living, unless they are in a suicidal state?

I can't say that relinquishing my faith changed my attitude about death very much. The circumstances under which I lived gave me numerous opportunities to think of death, and I was not too convinced God liked me enough to put me into "heaven," anyway.

However, now that I no longer have to justify the baffling indifference of a "loving" deity, it is much easier to reconcile my world view with what I often see on the evening news. And if anything, I live in greater peace now that I no longer believe in a sort of "Big Brother" watching my every move.

missus_gumby

Seeker, I agree with you. As a human, I fear the process of my demise, (hopefully it will be peaceful in my sleep, or not be too traumatic) as do most of us. Nevertheless, I think we all experience the same effect as being dead every time we fall asleep. What's so bad about the period between when we fall asleep and when we start dreaming? No conciousness, nothing, perfect calm and peace. I know what to expect, OK, it's not something to look forward to, but it doesn't seem too bad to me.

What need is there of an eternity in heaven or hell, when an eternity of perfect peace and calm is a rational alternative?

Just my €0.0125 worth.
Martin

sullster

I am always fascinated by personal recollections of men facing the immediate mortality of death in combat. It may be that the men who write such memoirs are the most mentally strong but I am always struck by how many are atheist or agnostic.

I have read two recollections by men who flew heavy bomber missions during WW2, who stated that they had contempt for the religiously devout in their crews. They considered these religious types as not contributing and hiding in their own worlds. When things got rough during the missions, the writers claimed that they would cry out for god's help, but such cries never led them to belief. Granted these were just two guys' feelings on the subject.

One personal history stands out for me. One soldier who was involved in daily brutal combat during the Battle of the Bulge claims to have been and still is an agnostic. He didn't beleive back then and all these years later still doesn't in spite of experiencing hell on earth almost 60 years ago.

These recollections don't anwer why christians are full of fear, but for me they show that atheists/agnostics can be towers of strength in the midst of extreme death and dying. These types just spit on the christian hell-threat, since they survived earthly hell, they have contempt for the unearthly hell threatened on them by christian cowards.

Seeker196

I think you guys have been missing my point...I don't think it's personal fear about their own deaths, I think it's compassion for the deaths of others.

That's why I said it was a 'noble' fear.

sighhswolf

Seeker,
For what it's worth, I dont think humans fear death as much as they fear "Nothingness".
That particular concept is one that is almost impossible for the average human to grasp.
Total, complete, nothingness, devoid of light, devoid of any feeling or any sensory input what so ever, for infinity. SHEOL

That is a fearful thing, and as humans we perceive
ourselves to be much to nobel a species to have death be the complete end, the start of nothingness. Religion in it's many forms promises that death will not be the end, that it will not be nothingness if you abide by the rules of the deity and dedicate your existence to it.

The aspect of death as a tangible and natural process of all life should not instill fear, it is the natural course of events for all lifeforms.
Humans just happen to be a lifeform that is so
self absorbed that we tend to want to believe that it is possible to continue on in some other form of being, after the body is no longer functioning.

So that promise of gaining a new form... of continuing on, that religion makes is just the candy that appeals to us humans and our self preoccupation.
What I fail to understand is why Christians will
deny evolution, but preach it as part of their doctrine.
If in fact the body dies, and the "soul" migrates
from the body to a higher plain of existence, that is very simply evolution.

So the part of christian doctrine that speaks to a higher and etheral existence after death is a form of evolution.
The evolution of the inner person, the intellect, the "soul" to a higher form, free from the bodily
constraints, of this world.

Now I as a non-theist have seen no evidence to validate this claim of a migration to a higher level of existence.
So I am content with the fact that my time here is limited, and I must make the best use of it NOW,
without planning ahead for my demise.
I have no evidence that there is anything after death so I try to make every day count and mean something in some small way.
Death is a natural conclusion of the progression of life, fear of death is irrational, fear of the "unknown" is a different matter.
We all harbor some fear of the unknown atheist and believer, non-theist and theologians. But some take the time in this life to perform for a divine entity that may or may not be able to provide some form of life after the death of the body, or offer an evolution to a higher plain of existence.
Wolf

Shake

They're afraid that everyone will really find out that there's no god! <img src="graemlins/boohoo.gif" border="0" alt="[Boo Hoo]" />

The Resistance

Because Christainity is based on faith and

&lt; puts Yoda's persona on&gt;

Faith leads to ignorance
Ignorance leads to fear

&lt; takes off Yoda persona &gt;

You know the rest


And I meant that too

sighhswolf

And "Fear is the mind killer", he says with his hand in the box.
Wolf

Bree

You should be. If you do something wrong - even one little thing - then straight to Hell you go.

It's futile to try and argue that God/Jesus forgave your past sins - or even that He/She/It forgives your present and future sins. Christians believe that God's love is not a blank cheque - you simply can't go on sinning and then count on God's love to forgive you.

Seeker196

Damn! Almost another Yoda quote!

"You should be"