Graeme

Humans were BUILT to engage in sex. It's pretty much our primary function.

lunachick

Wow, lotsa responses!

I haven't heard of Bishop Spong, but will look for his writings on the web. Thanks. He sounds pretty interesting considering his fundie background.

After reading these replies I'm even more convinced that Magdalene had to be his wife (even de facto wife) and mother of his children. Whether the story is historical fact or pure myth, I'm certain it must've started that way, but been later distorted to bring out the darker and more repressed virgin/whore dichtomies of the 2 Mary's. Weird though, huh? The virgin is mother. The whore is 'soulmate'.

Keep the replies coming if you have anything to add and I will delve into it further, too. Mary Magdalene is the figure that interests me most in religious tales, as she is the most earthly and honest of the biblical characters, in my limited knowledge opinion.

Cheers, everyone!

Opera Nut

The book I mentioned, THE WOMAN WITH THE ALABASTER JAR, also mentions the symbolism of the Black Madonna, with many shrines in France, the Black Madonna being the whore/Magdalene part of the virgin/whore dichotomy, possibly.

lunachick

Oh, PS: Gemma -

Nuns have a rep for being cruel and intolerant. I believe it is born of two things. One is their sexual repression. The other is because they have never 'partnered', or had children, they really don't know what it is to share and nurture. I'm sure not ALL are like that, but many are. They have never really had to 'give' of themselves or 'forgive' another their foibles, or be challenged by another in the real, human, earthly sense that only HUMAN love and the raising of children can bring. Their 'sacrifices' and 'humility' all stem from things that are not worldly and therefore cannot give them the tolerance and understanding of humanity they claim. They are inherently selfish creatures, looking out only for their own weird spiritual sanctity. Real HUMANS can only get in the way of that, and therefore become more and more the targets of their frustration, intolerance and selfishness.

Hmmm, I'm getting repetitive in this post...must get to sleep....g'night.

lunachick

I'll look out for the book, OperaNut. Cheers.
I visited a Black Madonna in Bavaria once. Can't remember the name of the place, it's a tiny village near Bad Aibling (my birthplace). It didn't realise there were many more! Thanks for the heads up.

Proxima Centauri

[quote]Originally posted by Gemma Therese:
<strong>If you insist on living in denial we can't stop you. I was there and I remember what those f***ing nuns were like.
That's a bad metaphore. The trouble with the nuns was that they were sexually frustrated and did not f**k.

<img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

[ November 06, 2002: Message edited by: B.Shack ]</p>

Gemma Therese

Dear, dear Lunachick,

The vast majority of religious sisters, now and throughout the ages, have been gentle women.

It is interesting that you do not consider sisters "human" because they do not have a husband and children. I should have realized how sex-saturated our thinking has become. I suppose if an older, unmarried, childless woman is attacked, a lesser sentence should be imposed, on account of the fact she was not fully "human".

Lunchachick, sisters and nuns are as human as yourself, although they see things in a different light. They experience fear, regret, love, joy, impatience, anger, sin, and forgiveness. They grieve at the death of a fellow sister or family member, rejoice at the birth of a niece or nephew, and suffer greatly during sickness. They have powerful friendships. Again, why are they not "human"?

Poverty, chastity, and obedience seem "real-world" and relevent to me. I would be shocked to learn tomorrow that humans no longer desired wealth, sex, or power.

The sisters are anything but selfish. They have dedicated their entire lives to God and their neighbor.

Lunachick, how many sisters do you know well, work for, or have spent a long period of time with? Have you visited a cloister?

I urge you to do two things -- watch Hayley Mills' film, "Trouble with Angels" and read the Autobiography of St. Therese of Lisieux.

By the by, "nuns" are cloistered women religious, while "sisters" are active and in the world.

God bless.

Gemma Therese

[ November 06, 2002: Message edited by: Gemma Therese ]</p>

Gemma Therese

I am sorry you had a bad experience with sisters. What order were they?

God bless,

Gemma Therese

[ November 06, 2002: Message edited by: Gemma Therese ]</p>

Proxima Centauri

DOMINICANS

Gemma Therese

Dominicans are wonderful women, from my experience.

Gemma Therese