Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Bruce Wildish · 05-26-2002, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by marduck:
<strong>Our Christian friends are the ones who claim Lucifer is the snake in Eden, to the Jews it was just what the Bible says it is, a talking snake. Most likey based on the Sumerian collection of creation myths, many of which are in The Epic of Gilgamesh, the worlds oldest known prose.
In the Sumerian version mankind loses the chance for eternal life by listening to the God of wisdom Ea/Enki and not to the great God Anu.
Ea tells Adam when he visits Anu in Heaven not to eat or drink anything or he will die, Adam goes to Heaven, Anu is impressed by Adams courage and offers him a drink of the water of life, to get eternal life, but Adam listens to the wiseass Ea and refuses it. TS, who wants to live forever anyway...
[ May 24, 2002: Message edited by: marduck ]</strong>

Those interested in this subject must read James Barr's "The Garden of Eden and the Hope of Immortality."

Marduk · 05-26-2002, 03:05 PM

" I'll take your word for it. OTOH, the snake is often considered Satan, no? Or at least that's what all the fundies proclaiming the Fall is the cause of all the "de-evolution" of all life, starting with the snakes (the vestigial pelvic bones in boa's for instance are used as "proof" of the Genesis curse, etc)."

Even among fundies there is dispute about the 'Snake' in fact there are also those who believe Satan and Lucifer are two different beings. Satan being an Angel of God who 'tests' mankind (the Jewish belief, they are true monotheists) and Lucifer being the leader of a rebellious group of angels who tried to overthrow God.
The Serpant was punished for getting A&E to eat the apple just like Prometheus was punished for giving fire to man, a good example of similar myth, but not if you believe the serpant was anything more than a serpant. This is where the fundies screwup IMHO. That is not Satan crawling around in my backyard.
I'm not familiar with the de-evolution stuff but it sounds like it contradicts the idea of the snake being Satan, of course contradiction would never stop a fundy from anything

.
BTW thanks for the book reference BW.

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05-26-2002, 03:05 PM	#12
Marduk Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: the 10th planet Posts: 5,065	" I'll take your word for it. OTOH, the snake is often considered Satan, no? Or at least that's what all the fundies proclaiming the Fall is the cause of all the "de-evolution" of all life, starting with the snakes (the vestigial pelvic bones in boa's for instance are used as "proof" of the Genesis curse, etc)." Even among fundies there is dispute about the 'Snake' in fact there are also those who believe Satan and Lucifer are two different beings. Satan being an Angel of God who 'tests' mankind (the Jewish belief, they are true monotheists) and Lucifer being the leader of a rebellious group of angels who tried to overthrow God. The Serpant was punished for getting A&E to eat the apple just like Prometheus was punished for giving fire to man, a good example of similar myth, but not if you believe the serpant was anything more than a serpant. This is where the fundies screwup IMHO. That is not Satan crawling around in my backyard. I'm not familiar with the de-evolution stuff but it sounds like it contradicts the idea of the snake being Satan, of course contradiction would never stop a fundy from anything . BTW thanks for the book reference BW.

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