Jimmy Higgins

New American Bible
As God Almighty I appeared to Abraham, Issac, and Jacob, but my name, Lord, I did not make known to them.

KJV
And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Issac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but my name Jehovah was I not known to them.

JPS Tanakh
I appeared to Abraham, Issac, and Jacob as El Shaddai, but I did not make myself known to them by my name (hebrew script of god's name).

I can't reproduce the Hebrew script because the font won't work, sorry.

But anyways, I was studying the OT and came across Exodus 6:3. I was shocked, because for the first time, I was referencing all my scripture from the JPS Tanakh, and not a Christian bible. When I hit Exodus 6:3, something I've read over and over in Christian Bibles, I knew I stumbled on something new.

Is there any specific reason why the Christian bibles decided to omit the fact that Abraham, Issac, and Jacob followed an El descendent god? I matched the specific parts with their respective bold or italics. The NAB and KJV refer to El Shaddai as God Almighty. Now, any late person who reads that won't think a second time about it. Change God Almighty to El Shaddai and then the ears perk up. Is this a bias for holding that name back and replacing it with a harmless substitute for Jahweh? I mean, I don't think the KJV ever mentions an El god. I know that the NAB does in Genesis in some parts, but the KJV is certainly biased.

Is there something big being held back on or am I just being paranoid?

FunkyRes

Just so you are aware- the hebrew script is Yahweh (YHWH) which some bibles translate as Jehova, and others as LORD (Usually all capitalized with the ORD a smaller script then the rest)

So basically- your bold and italic are screwed.

El Shadai is translates as "God Almighty" in the NAB and the KJV and YHWH is translated as LORD in the NAB and Jehova in the KJV

Does that clear it up for you?

Egoinos

Doesn't el shaddai have something to do with breasts...or am I just fantasising again?

Jimmy, most English Bibles tend not to put a great deal of Hebrew in them (like El Shaddai, Elohim, etc) on the basis that the people who read translations probably can't read Hebrew, and need something to tell them what the words mean. Some more modern translations include words like Yahweh, Elohim, Adonai, El Shaddai because those words are now becoming more familiar to the average Christian.

[Edited to add: For example the New Jerusalem Bible translates Exod 6:3 as:
To Abraham, Isaac and Jacob I appeared as El Shaddai, but I did not make my name Yahweh known to them ]

--Egoinos--

[ July 21, 2002: Message edited by: Egoinos ]</p>

Jimmy Higgins

Alright, so that hebrew text is JHWH. I wasn't too sure about that. However, I am still curious as El Shaddai. Mainly on the grounds that I think it has less to do with infamilarity and more to do with patching up a hole in the OT for the christians.

Specifically, when is El Shaddai ever mentioned in the Genesis? There is El Olam, El Roi, El Eloim (sp?), The God of Nahor, but never, atleast I can't find, is there El Shaddai. Where did the Priestly documents, come up with El Shaddai? I mean, the hole is obvious. They are trying to explain why there are other gods mentioned in Genesis. But they specifically never mention the other gods, only El Shaddai. How many Christian bibles actually use the the specific terms of the El gods in Exodus 6:3 regarding El Shaddai? I really haven't bothered to look that up, I will do so tonight.

More importantly, why isn't a bigger deal made out of Exodus 6:3 by use Satanic Atheists? After this Revelation at Sinai, Jahweh's name remains rather constant, especially when compared to other gods at the time, eg Marduck and Re. Granted there are a couple small variations, but its rather singular.

FunkyRes

What hole does it patch up?

It's a TRANSLATION.

You'll be surprised at how many english speaking speaking people only know of El Shaddai as a song that Amy Grant sung and wouldn't have a clue as to what it means.

And why should they?
They aren't of Jewish descent.
They don't have the cultural background.

Christianity likes to cater to new believers without requiring that they grew up in a culture to know what El Shaddai means.

Bible commentaries certainly cover things like this, so no- this is not a "conspiracy" issue at all. It is simply an issue of a readable translation for a largely gentile world.

I have no idea what "hole" this would be patching.

Jimmy Higgins

I appreciate the replies.

My question on the hole is that Christianity depends wholly that the Old Testament stands up. I've always felt the key to disproving Jesus is in Genesis and Exodus. You take away that foundation, Christianity doesn't have a hold. I'm probably wrong, but that has been my idea for a while now.

The hole it fills up is the fact that most christians don't know how many foreign gods are in Genesis. They think that the god is always their god. But this simply isn't the case as Exodus 6:3 points out. But what is most important is that Exodus 6:3 is pointing it out. The Priestly Document is doing it for a reason. Virtually nothing in the bible has neglible value. Each thing has a purpose. So when the Priestly Document in Exodus 6:3 says that god was using other images, it is clearly trying to patch up a hole that says, well, the beginning of history wasn't actually Abraham, but Moses, but don't let that bother you.

This break in Exodus 6:3 is important. It is pointing something out, for a reason. The priests are trying to make something legitimate, which leads one to think, why should they do that unless it isn't? The fact that Christian books don't place this in it, is a point as well. I think it has less to do with unfamilarity as it does on trying to make people think that Jahweh is much more singular through out the entire bible, and not the multiplicity it withholds in itself within Genesis.

FunkyRes

Christians are very aware that God was called by many names.

This is not a problem for Christians and more than it is for the Jews.

There is only one God, the God of Abraham.

Yahweh is one name he is called.
Elohim is another (I believe introduced by Melkizedek in the Bible).

God is not defined by which name he is called, the various names in the Bible for God refer to the same God.

Sorry- there is absolutely no conspiracy in Christianity (or Judaism) to hide this.

King Arthur

Jimmy, why do you insist on using "Javeh" when others have presented it correctly as "Yahweh"?

The letter J was not around back then. The letters of the tetragrammaton are "YHWH" (or yod [y], he [h], waw/vav [w/v], and he [h]). No one really knows what the vowels were. People today pronounce it either "Yehovah" or "Yahweh". The Jehovah's witness simply don't know what they heck they are talking about.

As for El Shaddai. 'El can be said to be a generic name for 'god'. 'Shaddai' apparently means "almighty" or "all powerful" as can be seen from the Greek word in the Septuagint - pantokrator - and the latin - omnipotens. Shaddai is used in the OT as a divine title for God and is used something like 48 times. It is not unique to this one verse.

Jimmy Higgins

Force of habit. My first book of study on the OT was by Gerhard von Rad. He spells it Jahweh. I'll take the spelling from a biblical scholar anyday. It is probably because of the language difference from German to English, perhaps. Doesn't matter. I'll use Jahweh anyday.

Moses is introduced to god by god saying he is the god of his forefathers, but that he went under a different name. It doesn't take a biblical scholar to notice that there is an incontinuity here.

When I mentioned that El Shaddai isn't used, I was referring to Genesis. I have not found an El Shaddai reference in Genesis. [looked it up]If you have a reference on Shaddei, I'd appreciate being able to look that up, thanks.[/looked it up]
{Editted for links}<a href="http://www.bibletopics.com/biblestudy/61.htm" target="_blank">El Shaddai references</a>

Yes, mentioned 48 times. However, mentioned in Job 31 times alone meaning that El Shaddai is rarely used in the OT. First use is in Gen 17:1, however, there is no exclusive use of that name in Genesis as Exodus 6:3 wants you to believe. And it is Elohim who is the god in the First Story of Creation. There is great incontinuity.

As for El being a generic name, well, that isn't quite right. El is of Canaanite descendence. Referring to a Canaanite god as your own in another religion is a bit bizarre.

[ July 23, 2002: Message edited by: Jimmy Higgins ]</p>

Jimmy Higgins

Elohim is the god who creates the universe. That is the first chapter of the bible. That is where he is introduced.

The two names Jahweh and Elohim exist because those were the names used by the two specific groups of Israelites. They meant the same god. However, El Eloi, El Roi, El Elam, El Shaddai were not the same sort of synonym.