Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Scottyman · 01-26-2003, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Novowels
Actually, people don't evolve, generations do.

So if we lived forever, we wouldn't evolve.

I completely disagree with you. The human species will develop to a point where it can create it's own evolution apart from external forces of nature. When we achieve that next step and move from our bodies to pure electrical impulses that in effect will be evolving. Where to go from there is anyones guess. My theory is that time will cease to be important on that level and biological life would almost seem like it's standing still and the universe will move in a way that almost looks like fluid.

TheCreature · 01-26-2003, 01:06 PM

I wouldn't want to live forever, not even a thousand years. I get bored easily.

Strawberry · 01-26-2003, 03:14 PM

I'd love to live a life that doesn't have the constant of time pressure on it in a body that's always fairly healthy. How many things could I learn? How many cultures could I experience? What would I be like 500 or 1000 years from now? Being able to take the time to spend a few years really digging into everything that vaguely intrigues me...I'd take that in a second.

Edited for grammar.

Loren Pechtel · 01-26-2003, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Scottyman
There is plenty of research ongoing into the field of mental transference or what some call "whole mind uploading" which is basically the transference of your concience into a supercomputer. Some are saying it's not too far off, perhaps 50 or so years away. I would opt for this without question. I think living in a flesh and bone body for many thousands of years would be an ordeal but to live for an eternity as pure thought in a virtual universe, now that would be salvation. You could always take a vacation inside someones body if you wanted to have the experience of a flesh and bone existence again!

Personally, I think 50 years is a conservative estimate. Well before then we will have enough processing power available to economically emulate the human mind. Even if we don't understand how it actually functions we could upload an emulation.

For many years now the guys who think about such stuff have predicted our desktop units (or something of similar price if the form changes by then) will be of human-level processing power by 2020. By 2050 the desktop units will be closing on the processing power of the entire human race.
Plotting actual progress against the curve shows that we are deviating from it somewhat--actual power is going up a bit FASTER than predicted.

Loren Pechtel · 01-26-2003, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Novowels
Actually, people don't evolve, generations do.

So if we lived forever, we wouldn't evolve.

Seems like a waste to me.

Oh and ju'iblex: These are the best years of our lives!

Isn't that fucking depressing?

Naturally, we wouldn't. However, that doesn't say that we couldn't engineer changes to the human form. Personally, I don't think we will have much in common with the humans of 2100.

Biff the unclean · 01-26-2003, 03:44 PM

There's an old Woody Allen quip "I don't want to gain immortality through my work. I want to gain it through not dying"
But of course it doesn't matter if we want to live forever or not. It isn't one of the available options.
Attended a friend's burial recently--those are happening more frequently these days. The Minister declared loudly and with great conviction to the widow that, "He isn't really dead�"
I muttered to my wife, "Then we ought to get the backhoe over here really quick." I swear that woman's elbow gets harder, or my ribs are getting softer, with each joke.

Scottyman · 01-26-2003, 03:53 PM

Here's that link to Transhuman in case anyone else is interested. I spoke to a scientist ( I think from MIT ) last year and he told me the problem isn't storage, it's the hardware that would allow the transference.

http://www.aleph.se/Trans/

capnkirk · 01-26-2003, 04:41 PM

WTF!!! How can you talk about wanting to live FOREVER...then express that desire on what it would be like to live (even if aging were completely suspended) for a couple of hundred, or even a thousand years!! FOREVER is a LOT longer than that! Consider how exciting(?) it would be to live for a billion years! (You STILL haven't scratched the surface of FOREVER!) Come on...give me a break!!!!

I wouldn't want to live forever...even in HEAVEN!!!

Marduk · 01-26-2003, 04:53 PM

bah! enough is enough, I agree with DMB. I don't want to be around humans any longer than absolutely necessary, they are beyond depressing, besides who the hell wants to go to work forever.

Scottyman · 01-26-2003, 05:00 PM

I've stated this before but I'll state it again.

When I die, I hope that I don't have to relive all the experiences I had in my mortal live with everyone I had already know. Most religions believe that when you die, you get to spend eternity with the people you knew and loved in this life. Yuck! I don't really want to relive my mortal life throughout eternity.

However, I can imagine how incredible it would be to be able to travel around the galaxy and possibly the universe with no constraints in regards to having a mortal body. I don't think anyone would measure time the same way. Traveling to another world would be similar to us traveling to the grocery store and there would be an ulimited number of things you could acomplish in the interim.

Maybe designing better ships to travel the stars or better bodies or vessels to carry your mind if you wanted to explore in some form of body. Your choices would be limitless. An unlimited number of virtual realities could be constructed so you could live in a virtual community amongst your friends or get away from them if you needed to.

Only the limits of your imagination would hold you back. I think war would be nonexistant and confrontations would be quite limited. Material wealth would be a non issue for the most part. We would probably carry some of our more feeble human traits with us but I think we would be able to deal with them better.

Hmmm, a chance to live forever and travel to the edge of the universe and beyond maybe or........ a certain death with no known guarantee of a continuing existence.

No contest....I would chose the former.

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01-26-2003, 01:06 PM	#22
TheCreature New Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Iowa, USA Posts: 4	I wouldn't want to live forever, not even a thousand years. I get bored easily.

01-26-2003, 03:14 PM	#23
Strawberry Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Lancaster, PA/Toronto, ON, Canada Posts: 627	I'd love to live a life that doesn't have the constant of time pressure on it in a body that's always fairly healthy. How many things could I learn? How many cultures could I experience? What would I be like 500 or 1000 years from now? Being able to take the time to spend a few years really digging into everything that vaguely intrigues me...I'd take that in a second. Edited for grammar.

01-26-2003, 03:44 PM	#26
Biff the unclean Banned Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: an inaccessible island fortress Posts: 10,638	There's an old Woody Allen quip "I don't want to gain immortality through my work. I want to gain it through not dying" But of course it doesn't matter if we want to live forever or not. It isn't one of the available options. Attended a friend's burial recently--those are happening more frequently these days. The Minister declared loudly and with great conviction to the widow that, "He isn't really dead�" I muttered to my wife, "Then we ought to get the backhoe over here really quick." I swear that woman's elbow gets harder, or my ribs are getting softer, with each joke.

01-26-2003, 03:53 PM	#27
Scottyman Regular Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Burbank, CA Posts: 138	Here's that link to Transhuman in case anyone else is interested. I spoke to a scientist ( I think from MIT ) last year and he told me the problem isn't storage, it's the hardware that would allow the transference. http://www.aleph.se/Trans/

01-26-2003, 04:41 PM	#28
capnkirk Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: where no one has gone before Posts: 735	WTF!!! How can you talk about wanting to live FOREVER...then express that desire on what it would be like to live (even if aging were completely suspended) for a couple of hundred, or even a thousand years!! FOREVER is a LOT longer than that! Consider how exciting(?) it would be to live for a billion years! (You STILL haven't scratched the surface of FOREVER!) Come on...give me a break!!!! I wouldn't want to live forever...even in HEAVEN!!!

01-26-2003, 04:53 PM	#29
Marduk Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: the 10th planet Posts: 5,065	bah! enough is enough, I agree with DMB. I don't want to be around humans any longer than absolutely necessary, they are beyond depressing, besides who the hell wants to go to work forever.

01-26-2003, 05:00 PM	#30
Scottyman Regular Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Burbank, CA Posts: 138	I've stated this before but I'll state it again. When I die, I hope that I don't have to relive all the experiences I had in my mortal live with everyone I had already know. Most religions believe that when you die, you get to spend eternity with the people you knew and loved in this life. Yuck! I don't really want to relive my mortal life throughout eternity. However, I can imagine how incredible it would be to be able to travel around the galaxy and possibly the universe with no constraints in regards to having a mortal body. I don't think anyone would measure time the same way. Traveling to another world would be similar to us traveling to the grocery store and there would be an ulimited number of things you could acomplish in the interim. Maybe designing better ships to travel the stars or better bodies or vessels to carry your mind if you wanted to explore in some form of body. Your choices would be limitless. An unlimited number of virtual realities could be constructed so you could live in a virtual community amongst your friends or get away from them if you needed to. Only the limits of your imagination would hold you back. I think war would be nonexistant and confrontations would be quite limited. Material wealth would be a non issue for the most part. We would probably carry some of our more feeble human traits with us but I think we would be able to deal with them better. Hmmm, a chance to live forever and travel to the edge of the universe and beyond maybe or........ a certain death with no known guarantee of a continuing existence. No contest....I would chose the former.

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