Freethought & Rationalism Archive

flurpy2 · 07-06-2003, 10:28 AM

I was told a story by a scientist friend which runs like this:

Centuries ago, at the dawn of sea travel, the only fertilizer known was horse/ cattle manure.

As it had to be shipped, Merchants of this manure would dry it out to make it ligter, and therefor easier to transport as cargo on ships.

Since it was at first stored on the deck of a ship, it would often get wet and draw water after a storm or if the ship had a leak.

What would happen is this: The manure would react with the water, and form Methane gas.
Ever so often, a seaman would go down in the storage room with a lantern, which would light up the Methane gas, as KABOOM.

When it was realized what caused this explotions, the instructions printed on the bags of dried manure would read:
"Ship High In Transit", or S.H.I.T., meaning that if it was stored on a shelve above the deck, the risk of it getting wet would be minimized.

From there the word SHIT.

Okay, this story has all the elements of an urban rumor, but I was just wondering if anyone know:
1. Is it scientifically possible?
2. Is it a nonsense story?

Regards Hendrik

Valentine Pontifex · 07-06-2003, 10:47 AM

The word "shit" did not start as an acroynm. How do I know? I just looked up the word in the dictionary which traces it to the old English word scite which means dung or scitte which means diarrhea.

beastmaster · 07-06-2003, 11:28 AM

Clever fiction.

Shit derives from the (IIRC) Germanic/Nordic (?) root to separate.

Absolutely no word was ever formed by acronym until World War II. Thus, disbelieve all the folkloric "acronymic" etymologies for FUCK and POSH and other words, cuz they are false false false.

Note that I believe that a lot of Bible mythologies are also based on similar folk etymologies. E.g., the Egyptian name Moses sounds like the ancient Hebrew word to draw out; ergo the myth that the infant Moses was drawn out of the Nile on a papyrus ark by the Pharoah's daughter. There are many other examples and I'd love to start a thread when I have time about the many folk etymological origins of Bible stories. But my point here is that it is interesting that, 6,000 years ago up until the present day, people will invent and believe the wildest stories if it purports to explain the origins of a curious word.

beastmaster · 07-06-2003, 11:33 AM

Oh, as to your first question, about the scientific plausibility, I don't know.

But I wonder about the economic feasibility of shipping manure. Who uses manure? Farmers. Who makes manure? Farmers. So why ever bother shipping it from overseas?

Shit ain't silk or spices. It's pretty much freely available onsite.

demoninho · 07-06-2003, 12:05 PM

hendrik, do you have the word "schijt" in afrikaans?

flurpy2 · 07-06-2003, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by demoninho
hendrik, do you have the word "schijt" in afrikaans?

Not really - closest one with possibly the same ancestry is "skyt".
Synonyms (how do you spell that one!) in afrikaans is
kak, drek, poefie, ontlasting, mis, gwano, bollie, stront.

Wow, with all those words for shit, no wonder so much of our humor centres around that theme!

Toto · 07-06-2003, 01:42 PM

Snopes debunks it

demoninho · 07-06-2003, 01:53 PM

ij and y are interchangeable in dutch spelling

and we got the following in holland too: kak, drek, ontlasting, stront.

and a whole shit load more

NoDeity · 07-06-2003, 04:26 PM

For a second, I thought (with some surprise) this might have been about the Super-Homeopathic Institute of Technology...

http://nodeity.com/gulli-go/SHIT.html

Lobstrosity · 07-06-2003, 09:20 PM

Ok, well if shit didn't derive its origins from this, perhaps the term "poop deck" did?

07-06-2003, 10:28 AM	#1
flurpy2 Junior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: south africa Posts: 20	S.H.I.T story - is it true I was told a story by a scientist friend which runs like this: Centuries ago, at the dawn of sea travel, the only fertilizer known was horse/ cattle manure. As it had to be shipped, Merchants of this manure would dry it out to make it ligter, and therefor easier to transport as cargo on ships. Since it was at first stored on the deck of a ship, it would often get wet and draw water after a storm or if the ship had a leak. What would happen is this: The manure would react with the water, and form Methane gas. Ever so often, a seaman would go down in the storage room with a lantern, which would light up the Methane gas, as KABOOM. When it was realized what caused this explotions, the instructions printed on the bags of dried manure would read: "Ship High In Transit", or S.H.I.T., meaning that if it was stored on a shelve above the deck, the risk of it getting wet would be minimized. From there the word SHIT. Okay, this story has all the elements of an urban rumor, but I was just wondering if anyone know: 1. Is it scientifically possible? 2. Is it a nonsense story? Regards Hendrik

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07-06-2003, 10:47 AM	#2
Valentine Pontifex Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Orion Arm of the Milky Way Galaxy Posts: 3,092	The word "shit" did not start as an acroynm. How do I know? I just looked up the word in the dictionary which traces it to the old English word scite which means dung or scitte which means diarrhea.

07-06-2003, 11:28 AM	#3
beastmaster Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Madrid / I am a: Lifelong atheist Posts: 885	Clever fiction. Shit derives from the (IIRC) Germanic/Nordic (?) root to separate. Absolutely no word was ever formed by acronym until World War II. Thus, disbelieve all the folkloric "acronymic" etymologies for FUCK and POSH and other words, cuz they are false false false. Note that I believe that a lot of Bible mythologies are also based on similar folk etymologies. E.g., the Egyptian name Moses sounds like the ancient Hebrew word to draw out; ergo the myth that the infant Moses was drawn out of the Nile on a papyrus ark by the Pharoah's daughter. There are many other examples and I'd love to start a thread when I have time about the many folk etymological origins of Bible stories. But my point here is that it is interesting that, 6,000 years ago up until the present day, people will invent and believe the wildest stories if it purports to explain the origins of a curious word.

07-06-2003, 11:33 AM	#4
beastmaster Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Madrid / I am a: Lifelong atheist Posts: 885	Oh, as to your first question, about the scientific plausibility, I don't know. But I wonder about the economic feasibility of shipping manure. Who uses manure? Farmers. Who makes manure? Farmers. So why ever bother shipping it from overseas? Shit ain't silk or spices. It's pretty much freely available onsite.

07-06-2003, 12:05 PM	#5
demoninho Senior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 927	hendrik, do you have the word "schijt" in afrikaans?

07-06-2003, 01:42 PM	#7
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	Snopes debunks it

07-06-2003, 01:53 PM	#8
demoninho Senior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 927	ij and y are interchangeable in dutch spelling and we got the following in holland too: kak, drek, ontlasting, stront. and a whole shit load more

07-06-2003, 04:26 PM	#9
NoDeity Regular Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: British Columbia, Canada Posts: 480	For a second, I thought (with some surprise) this might have been about the Super-Homeopathic Institute of Technology... http://nodeity.com/gulli-go/SHIT.html

07-06-2003, 09:20 PM	#10
Lobstrosity Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: San Diego, California Posts: 719	Ok, well if shit didn't derive its origins from this, perhaps the term "poop deck" did?

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