Freethought & Rationalism Archive

streamline · 07-18-2003, 01:16 PM

I encountered the following link on a thread in the Evolution forum:

Baptistboard.com

I followed the link, and -- initially -- for [sic] fun started reading through some of the threads.

Ugh. Now I find myself getting crabby and in a bad mood. Once again, I get slapped with the clammy wet rag of reality -- these people are for real, and I am suddenly feeling rather cynical and down about the prospects for our species to ever leave behind this self-centered god-talk. It just seems that so many people cannot sleep at night if they are not the raison d'�tre for the universe. Obviously, since science continues to demolish this parochial view of existence, it is forever attacked or aped by all manner of theists and mystics (though, naturally, the same parties gladly partake of science's offspring -- technology -- whenever convenient).

Sometimes I can laugh at it, other times summon up the drive to debate it, but far too often it just leaves me feeling drained and depressed. Theistic arguments are the same old same old, yet the revival tent never seems to want for newly-minted True Believers. Oh, and now it is almost downright unpatriotic to not believe in the existence of gods.

In short, I am feeling a bit like an atheist in his Alamo. I cannot help but think we are a doomed species, and it will be all God's (ie, our) fault.

King Rat · 07-18-2003, 01:38 PM

If it makes you feel any better the missionary fervor seems to be dying down. Soon they will all inbreed and end up nine-headed-albinos (all heads saved of course). This will make them easier to identify and shun.

Charlie · 07-18-2003, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by streamline
I encountered the following link on a thread in the Evolution
.
.
.
In short, I am feeling a bit like an atheist in his Alamo. I cannot help but think we are a doomed species, and it will be all God's (ie, our) fault.

I feel I've been right there with you! From disbelief of all the belief, to ignoring it, to jumping in and debating/becoming active, to asking Q's trying to better understand why they believe, to debating again, to once again ignoring...

Humans are a fascinating creature. I would have to say that we are mostly a superstitious species willing to believe just about anything! Because of this, I have given in to the thought that we will always have religion! As long as there are humans there will be religion. Think about it.. if there were no humans on this planet there would be no religion.

I am glad to see more and more people realizing that they are atheist and becoming active. I plan to no longer 'ignore' as I feel it important to fight for freedom to believe and/or not believe. I, and most atheist, have absolutely no problem with someone who wants to believe in a god/religion. The problem occurs when they try to convert (push it on) everyone else, ie. prayer in schools, "under God" in the pledge, "In God we trust" on our money, christians trying to take over our government... how can this be true freedom of religion!

So hang in there! Be strong! An have a drink (that always helps.. until the next morning sometimes)

Scandal · 07-18-2003, 07:39 PM

Charlie,

Although I believe in God I too hate the idea of religion encroaching on our government.

How can we prevent this when judges and senators are influenced by their religious beliefs? I guess we demand absolute separation of church and state.

Diadectes · 07-19-2003, 04:54 AM

Quote:

(though, naturally, the same parties gladly partake of science's offspring -- technology -- whenever convenient).

This is so true. In the bad old days when I used to socialise with evangelical Christians (I tend not to bother now - life's too short) I was always fascinated by the way they displayed their hostility to science by purchasing televisions, radios, videos, DVD's, CD's, cars, washing machines, microwave ovens etc etc. Or by the habit that they had of attending hospital when they were ill, taking medicine for their ailments, and wearing glasses for their poor eyesight. Their hostility was so great that occasionally they even boarded planes, trains, or boats to go on holiday!

Seriously though, they used to tell me that all these were things that God had 'allowed', but that we'd gone too far now by taking seriously such concepts as 'evilution' (ho ho, what wits they were!) and listening to people like Carl Satan (I kid ye not, that's what they called him - pretty pathetic really, since Mr Sagan frequently displayed far more compassion, humility and basic good common sense than most evangelical Christians do in a month of fundamentalist Sundays).

So I fully sympathise with your despair, but yes, have a couple of drinks, consider the sheer absurdity of the Christian religion, go outside, take at look at the stars and console yourself with the thought that even if there is something Big going on out there, it's most likely going to be infinitely more amazing than anything dreamed up by the piffling parochial myths of earthly religion.

Rational BAC · 07-19-2003, 05:38 AM

Christian fundamentalism has its ups and downs. Very high during the 80's, then kind of petered out. Up again now because of the recent war and a fairly popular Fundy President and a distaste by some of the so called "immorality" of the Clinton years.

Iraq will turn into a quagmire, and Bush's popularity will tank pretty quickly along with the popularity of his "you are either with us or against us" mentality. The American people will long for the pragmatism of the Clinton years.

The American public grows weary of fads very quickly. Just like we are very soon growing weary of the "peace" in Iraq, we will soon grow weary of the phony "patriotism" of today and we will also grow weary of this latest outburst of Christian fundamentalism. Hard core Fundies we will always have-------but the "hangers on" will soon lose interest.

Give it time. All things even out in the long run.

I expect a serious reaction against Christian fundamentalism and a serious growth in skepticism of all kinds within the next few years.

livius drusus · 07-19-2003, 11:33 AM

I feel your pain, streamline. I try to avoid christian boards as much as humanly possible because I prefer my brain unstultified, but when I have on occasion followed a link, it has been an exercise in tooth-gritting frustration.

I'm moving this thread to Secular Lifestyle where the oh my gog xians are everywhere relief squad resides.

Buddrow_Wilson · 07-19-2003, 11:45 AM

Streamline, You are not alone. I have to believe that our kind are increasing in population. Otherwise, it would truly be hopeless.

Rev. Joshua · 07-19-2003, 01:02 PM

Well, I'm a baptist minister, and I found my first few visits to BaptistBoard to be a huge culture shock. The baseline there is far to the right of any baptist group I've been a part of.

Joshua

Heathen · 07-19-2003, 01:03 PM

Streamline, I feel the same. I've browsed around BaptistBoard, too, but if you think that's bad, go check out the fundy forum. It's just as bad, if not worse. Some posts make me laugh, some make me want to weep for humanity, and some just make me wonder how on earth people can believe all that crap. *shrug* Well, you're not alone. Frustrating, isn't it? Just makes you want to.. :banghead:

07-18-2003, 01:16 PM	#1
streamline Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 77	This god bit isn't going away, is it .. please, someone cheer me up. Fast. I encountered the following link on a thread in the Evolution forum: Baptistboard.com I followed the link, and -- initially -- for [sic] fun started reading through some of the threads. Ugh. Now I find myself getting crabby and in a bad mood. Once again, I get slapped with the clammy wet rag of reality -- these people are for real, and I am suddenly feeling rather cynical and down about the prospects for our species to ever leave behind this self-centered god-talk. It just seems that so many people cannot sleep at night if they are not the raison d'�tre for the universe. Obviously, since science continues to demolish this parochial view of existence, it is forever attacked or aped by all manner of theists and mystics (though, naturally, the same parties gladly partake of science's offspring -- technology -- whenever convenient). Sometimes I can laugh at it, other times summon up the drive to debate it, but far too often it just leaves me feeling drained and depressed. Theistic arguments are the same old same old, yet the revival tent never seems to want for newly-minted True Believers. Oh, and now it is almost downright unpatriotic to not believe in the existence of gods. In short, I am feeling a bit like an atheist in his Alamo. I cannot help but think we are a doomed species, and it will be all God's (ie, our) fault.

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07-18-2003, 01:38 PM	#2
King Rat Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 6,855	If it makes you feel any better the missionary fervor seems to be dying down. Soon they will all inbreed and end up nine-headed-albinos (all heads saved of course). This will make them easier to identify and shun.

07-18-2003, 07:39 PM	#4
Scandal Regular Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Arizona Posts: 131	Charlie, Although I believe in God I too hate the idea of religion encroaching on our government. How can we prevent this when judges and senators are influenced by their religious beliefs? I guess we demand absolute separation of church and state.

07-19-2003, 05:38 AM	#6
Rational BAC Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Tampa Bay area Posts: 3,471	Christian fundamentalism has its ups and downs. Very high during the 80's, then kind of petered out. Up again now because of the recent war and a fairly popular Fundy President and a distaste by some of the so called "immorality" of the Clinton years. Iraq will turn into a quagmire, and Bush's popularity will tank pretty quickly along with the popularity of his "you are either with us or against us" mentality. The American people will long for the pragmatism of the Clinton years. The American public grows weary of fads very quickly. Just like we are very soon growing weary of the "peace" in Iraq, we will soon grow weary of the phony "patriotism" of today and we will also grow weary of this latest outburst of Christian fundamentalism. Hard core Fundies we will always have-------but the "hangers on" will soon lose interest. Give it time. All things even out in the long run. I expect a serious reaction against Christian fundamentalism and a serious growth in skepticism of all kinds within the next few years.

07-19-2003, 11:33 AM	#7
livius drusus Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Selva Oscura Posts: 4,120	I feel your pain, streamline. I try to avoid christian boards as much as humanly possible because I prefer my brain unstultified, but when I have on occasion followed a link, it has been an exercise in tooth-gritting frustration. I'm moving this thread to Secular Lifestyle where the oh my gog xians are everywhere relief squad resides.

07-19-2003, 11:45 AM	#8
Buddrow_Wilson Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Arkansas Posts: 1,589	Streamline, You are not alone. I have to believe that our kind are increasing in population. Otherwise, it would truly be hopeless.

07-19-2003, 01:02 PM	#9
Rev. Joshua Junior Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Atlanta Posts: 63	Well, I'm a baptist minister, and I found my first few visits to BaptistBoard to be a huge culture shock. The baseline there is far to the right of any baptist group I've been a part of. Joshua

07-19-2003, 01:03 PM	#10
Heathen Regular Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Texas Posts: 200	Streamline, I feel the same. I've browsed around BaptistBoard, too, but if you think that's bad, go check out the fundy forum. It's just as bad, if not worse. Some posts make me laugh, some make me want to weep for humanity, and some just make me wonder how on earth people can believe all that crap. shrug Well, you're not alone. Frustrating, isn't it? Just makes you want to.. :banghead:

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