Pomp

MeBeMe,

...people who think it's funny when billions of animals are beaten...most of the people posting in this thread.

Who, precisely, had expressed the opinion that the notion of animals being tortured is amusing?

John Page

MeBeMe is a person. All people are animals. Therefor MeBeMe would be killing animals. Therefore MeBeMe would kill self to create vegetarian utopia. Entirely logical.

[ April 10, 2002: Message edited by: John Page ]</p>

Wyrdsmyth

I'm not against raising animals for meat, but I am against torturing them. Two completely different issues in my opinion.

hal9000

It’s interesting that with the exception of MeBeMe who got canned for his reply, that no veggies have been able to step up to the plate and tackle this question. Spin and The AntiChris and the rest have no clue how to solve this dilemma.

David M. Payne

As I thought, no vegetarian fundamentalists have been able to come up with a reasonable regime for achieving the desired result without resorting to some form of authoritarian social system to achieve their goals. MeBeMe gave it a go, but he was into killing those who would defy his rule as king. (I guess, I missed his reply and only got a few bits and pieces of what he said before he got banned for it.)
In the end it is impossible for those like PETA, or my personal favorites the ALF, (Animal Liberation Front) who espouse extreme solutions to ending the practice of eating meat, to articulate any meaningful way to get to that stage without resorting to some form of authoritarian social structure. You guys talk the talk, but you can’t walk the walk, without destroying democracy in the process. There are worse things than eating meat, and extremism in the name of anything is one of them. In this regard you are no different than the religious fundies who would kill us all to save us from our sins. Take a good look in the mirror, for you are them, with a different “Holy” agenda. So all your talk leaves you <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

[ April 11, 2002: Message edited by: David Payne ]</p>

David M. Payne

Double post. I thought my first post didn't get posted. Looks like Hal and I posted at the same time

[ April 11, 2002: Message edited by: David Payne ]

[ April 11, 2002: Message edited by: David Payne ]</p>

hal9000

Sorry about that DP.

free12thinker

I've been a vegetarian forever and my entire family is vegetarian. That said, the only way to conjur up some "meat free world" is to brainwash everyone. Meat is an institution like religion. It's just always been that way. And just as some atheists would like to see a free thinkinf bibleless world, it's impossible when so much is advertised from year one in our lives. The same goes for meat and diet. Those two words just fit together.

I never blame people for being meat eaters, I simply can't expect that something as widely accepted and drilled into our heads for so long as meat, would ever be looked at as bad, when I honestly believe people don't believe it's bad. So if no one sees it as wrong, than it is socially right.

Of course I have my own objections to it, but I must also realize that I have grown up with vegetarians so there must be some consideration taken from that.

Bottom line: Until people are conditioned to eat non-meat products from birth, than we cannot expect to ever see a vegetarian society.

tronvillain

Well, unless an economical substitute could be found.

excreationist

To those who avoid eating red meat:
In Australia there is a new advertising campaign called <a href="http://www.redmeat-feelgood.com.au/feelgood/default.html" target="_blank">Red Meat. Feel Good.</a>
In the ads there are butchers dancing around.
So there are emotional reasons why people might eat meat, particularly red meat.