Harumi

What do you mean?

Going out and cramming atheism down people's throats?

Picketing and going on TV to spread rationality and atheism?

What?

I just pass books to people. Lately I let my friend borrow Losing Faith in Faith by Dan Barker. His brother read it, and deconverted.

Gave me a warm and fuzzy feeling inside.

For the most part, I keep to myself. Many of my friends are liberal theists. They have their lives, they have their beliefs, and as they are not hurting anyone, I don't see a point to tell them about atheism. They know I'm an atheist. They don't care.

*shrug*

I have yet to meet a theist who has reacted badly to my atheism. Until one does, I'll live my life, study, and try to get into college. I have a busy life. I have my own interests. And I prefer to leave people alone. Going out there shoving things down people's throats just really strikes me as being...fundie.

SecularFuture

EverLastingGodStopper,
No problemmo! I love your name, by the way.

And please keep up the good work, and continue to encourage others to follow in your footsteps. You’re doing excellent work for the secular community.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Harumi
Oh no! That’s the biggest mistake you could make.

How can you help secularism:
• Be open about your secular views
• Engage in conversation and debate (not with everyone)
theres other reasons – just can’t think of them now

Anyhow ~

One thing that you MUST understand:
• Your rights as an atheist are very limited.

As an ‘out of closet atheist’, it will be very hard for you, in most cases, to get a high level job.

For example: Do you think that you, as an atheist, could ever be elected president of the United States?

Aside from having the required personal and professional life, I feel that it may be our responsibility to partake in some form of activism. If we don’t fight for our rights, who will?

We must help clear the many misconceptions about our lifestyle. We are not "evil haters of god", as many believe.

SecularFuture

BOOKS FOR THE SECULARIST!!

Bookman

I don't know SecularFuture; you tell me.

I am a devoted father and husband trying very hard to educate my children and maintain a pleasant home for them to grow up in. I am a valuable and productive manager in the company for which I work.

In addition, I am open about my beliefs with my family, co-workers, and friends. I do not engage them in "debates" but I'll happily discuss the issues that are mutually of interest. I'd love for those around me to have the non-descript atheist that exists only in their imagination replaced by me. I consider myself a kind, gentle and moral person, and that's an image that the atheist community can use, in my opinion.

Other than that, I devote some time to the moderation of this community, but that's about it.

I don't give money to any atheist or CSS organizations, but I may someday. I don't accost strangers or preach the value of atheism and humanism. I don't try to convert people who, like my wife, have a relationship with what they perceive as god.

Other than contribute some of my income to the cause, I'm not certain what else you would have me do. Currently, my money goes to the household budget, a cash reserve, and retirement and college investing.

Is that enough, or am I "all talk"?

Bookman

Harumi

I will concede that you have a point. However, I live a very sheltered life. My highschool is the the top school in the country as a matter of fact. Practically everyone I know is either non-religious, deist, agnostic, or atheist. The few theists I am friends with are very liberal, and for the most part, religion doesn't play much of a role in their lives.

Even the church I go to is very secular, and we actually do charities there. The people at church know I'm an atheist, and although one has said that Christianity had made a difference for her, she has not pursued any further.

Must be that I'm lucky.

My classmates are going to start an atheist/freethinkers club at school. It'll be great.

DMB

SecularFuture: I found your OP pretty off-putting, particularly since you adorned it with the angry red face. You may not have intended it, but it comes across to me as bullying.

Members of this board may have many different motivations and judgements of what is most important. I think it's up to us to decide for oursleves what we ought to be doing and how we should be interacting with the world around us.

My entirely personal view of what matters to me depends on how I classify myself. Yes, I am a secularist. Yes, I am a rationalist. Yes, I am an atheist. But first and foremost I consider myself a humanist. Based on that, I care about the needs of human beings and their environment. I care about human rights and fulfilling human potential. And I apportion my spare resources accordingly.

I say spare resources, because I think I'd be a pretty poor humanist if I didn't care first for my family and friends.

I like IIDB, because I meet interesting and congenial people here. It's a place to relax and enjoy myself. I also learn a lot here. I have occasionally even asked for support from fellow members for certain campaigns, but I accept the fact that what seems extremely important to me may not rouse others.

Since I feel that I get a lot from II, I have recently started to make a modest financial contribution to SecWeb, but since I have many other interests, it will never be my top priority.

I think that most of us have our own ways of doing our bit for the non-theist ideology and way of life; we aren't all cut from the same cloth.

SecularFuture

Bookman
You're a good guy! I, personally, feel that it would be a good thing if you were a little more involved with your people, but oh well. You're still a good guy.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Harumi
Get out and live!

Where do you live?

Exactly. Or - just in the right place with the right people.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

DMB
Oh come on. They're cartoon faces. They're not any part of my real face.

I just have stong opinions.

Agreed.

Bookman

Fair enough.

themistocles

No talk or walk. I'm secure in my atheism and could give a flying flip about what superstitions others may have or their opinions of my lack thereof, so long as said superstitious are not planning to insert nails into my eyes or sacrifice goats on my lawn. I'd definately be more interested in talking and walking if those situations happen to arrive, mind you.

GaryP

In my local paper, a few years ago, there was a front page picture of the superintendent of the city schools looking up to heaven with a "beatified" face.

Turns out he had just seen a David Barton movie that was presented by the local chapter of the American Family Assocication.

Later that school year, I attended my son's academic Awards ceremony at a Jr. Hi which was called to order by a prayer given by the principal.

Early the next school year, it was reported in the paper that the school system had put together a " Common Ground Committee" which consisted of a few board members and several local clergy. This committee came up with guidelines for how the city schools and churches would get along with each other.

Most of the guidelines consisted of common sense rights that were already covered by the Constitution. But some were very problematical, e.g., "the system encourages staff and students to become involved with a religious organization" and "teachers must remain neutral if creationism is brought up by a student".

Well, this was all too much for me to take without speaking out.

I have, in the past few years, complained about, and had varying degrees of success (with help mostly from Americans United) with the following;

1. Changed or deleted the wording in the above mentioned guidelines;

2. Supposedly "secularized" the city's Nativity scene;

3. Had prayer discontinued at local university's commencement:

4. Had hymns discontinued at local High School graduation (and it is no longer referred to as a commencement/baccaulaureate);

5. Complained aboout a principal praying with students at the "See You at the Pole" Day;

6. Convinced the local public library to order a couple Atheist books;

7. Donated a pro-separation book to the Jr. Hi where the principal was praying;

8. Complained about christian rock being played throughout the HS building on the PA system

9. Brought to the school's attention that the Athletic Director should not have helped organize the Fellowship of Christian Athletes. ( I was assured that he does "not pray" with the kids),

10. Written several letters to the editor supporting evolution , chuch/state separation and the library's no censorship policy;

11 Donated money to AU, ACLU, American Atheists, FFRF, & People for the American Way.

12. Complained about local HS choirs not only singing hymns but performing them in churches.

I think my next project is going to be whether the opening prayer of my local city council is legal or not.

I am also troubled by the cross & Star of David on the veteran's monument downtown. But I think that I would probably have to be prepared to move out of town if I ever take on that one!

Anyhow, this was a very gradual process for me. I bitched about these kind of things for years. Then one day my teen-age son said, "If you feel so strongly, why don't you do something?" He, of course was right, so I started doing "something".

Many of us who write on these boards are in different stages of finding our voice. I don't think any need to feel guilty about what we have or haven't done.

With a guy like GWB as president, I think that many of us will continue to find our voice and it will become louder and more clear.