David Mathews

Hello Everyone,

I visited the Clearwater Coin Show this afternoon and was looking at
several spectacular ancient coins that showed no damage and little
wear in spite of their being more than 2500 years old. In that state
of preservation the coins are not merely coins, they are little works
of classical art. I would have bought the coins, except that they
were quite expensive: $10,750 for one and $26,000 for the other.

Beyond the mere triviality of the desire to possess, another much
more profound thought occured to me. These silver coins are 2500
years old, the silver atoms which compose the coin are at least 5
billion years old.

The silver was cooked in the nuclear furnace of a dying star and
released into interstellar space in a supernova. As the star
exploded it shone more brilliantly than the whole galaxy and
scattered its wealth into space. Eventually gravity would collect
these atoms together and form our solar system and our planet. The
silver was concentrated by geological forces in the crust until it
was eventually mined by ancient Greeks and made into a coin which
somehow survived two and a half millennia and travelled across an
ocean to be appreciated by coin collectors who would buy it except
that they lack twenty-six grand to spend on such things as coins.

Possession is a wonderful thing but there is no loss for those who
cannot buy a coin. The thought that the coin provided is actually
more valuable than the coin: A constrast of scales relative to time.
I perceive the coin as ancient though it is merely twenty five
centuries old, the silver itself is so ancient that twenty five
centuries are merely a blink of the eye. The silver began its
journey perhaps six billion years ago.

Even more profound is the following thought: In twenty-five
centuries the coin will become five thousand years old. By that time
I would have been dead for at least twenty-four centuries, it is also
extremely likely that the United States will cease to exist at some
point in the next millennia and by that time all artifacts of the present would will be considered ancient remains.

At some point a future generation may fail to appreciate the
beauty and value of that ancient coin. The coin could be melted down
and used for jewelry. Whether or not the coin still remains, the
silver will undoubtedly still continue to exist.

If the Universe existed for an additional six billion years, the
silver will still exist. Silver atoms are essentially eternal. As
long as the Universe exist, those silver atoms will exist. Long
after the sun has burned out and human civilization has ceased to
exist, the silver will still exist.

For those who are impressed by such things, I should also say that
the atoms which compose your body will still exist in that far
distant age. Consider it well: Long after you have ceased to exist,
long after the Earth's crust has melted below the Red Giant sun, long
after the sun itself would have exhausted its fuel, all of these
atoms which surround you will still continue to exist in essentially
the same form as they are now.

I should think that you would be happy to know that some part of you
is essentially eternal. The physical body will die and return to the
dust, but that dust is going to last forever.

Sincerely,

David Mathews
<a href="http://www.geocities.com/dmathew1" target="_blank">David Mathews' Home Page</a>

Philosoft

<strong>Quoth Dave:

I should think that you would be happy to know that some part of you
is essentially eternal.</strong>

Why should this make us happy?

David Mathews

Hello Philosoft,

David: That's a good question. Why should anything make us happy?

Sincerely,

David Mathews

The Other Michael

David,

Greco/Roman coins are generally available for as little as sixty cents. Of course, they are pretty worn and corroded, but $30-40 can get a nice enough one with some clear features on it.

cheers,
Michael

joedad

David,

Do you have a vision of the future that makes you happy?

joe

David Mathews

Hello Joe,

David: I don't have any visions of the future to make me happy. The future will bring whatever it brings.

Sincerely,

David Mathews

John Page

What, no soul damned for an eternity? Only dust? Does your spirit not live on in the memes that you begat?

BTW the Egptians also beleived in an afterlife if you'd been pickled in jars first. I guess this was one of the reasons Chrstianity and Islam were so succesful - populist religion.

Cheers, John

joedad

I think that's kind of sad actually. Don't you have some kind of vision of what you would like the future of humanity to be?

For example, if you were a human two-thousand years hence, and chanced upon this exchange, and knw something about these times from historical accounts, what would you think about us? Would you see any of yourself in those two hapless humans having a conversation way in the past? Wouldn't you connect somehow? How do you envision that future that you would be looking back from? You never think about that?

joe

99Percent

David Mathews: I detect a lament on your part by being aware of the fact that our relative human existence seems insignificant in relation to the age of stars, the universe and silver coins.

Undoubtedly there is nothing you can do to remedy this apparently sad situation. We will live a set amount of years and thats that. Question is why are you so set into lamenting the fact so much? Why do you insist in placing your existence from a very wide perspective? Don't you realize that the only perspective that is valid is the one that is coming from your own self? The more you try to center it from yourself the more significant your own existence becomes and the more you will appreciate it and enjoy it.

Comparing futily your time and space in relation to the whole universe only makes you feel like a little piece of insignificant shit. It is a losing and wasteful proposition.

The belief in God is even worse, because you compare what you feel is your miserable existence in relation to a perfect, timeless, infinite being (but purely of your imagination arising from a lack of self-esteem).

It sounds at first absurd, but having a wholly egocentric view of your life will make it actually last forever, since you can only be aware of your life when you are alive. Your theistic belief makes the latter proposition the opposite and this is what is a shame because it is your only life you will ever live.

beachbum

Good Morning David and all,

There is a very simple philosophy that I read about some months ago. Unfortunately, I do not recall what group it is that holds this belief:
The idea of two deaths. Everyone dies and that is the first death.

They are not truely dead until the last person who can remember them is dead. This is the second and final death.

Interesting.