christ-on-a-stick

Dangit Helen you beat me!!! (grumbles)

And of course you were able to say it in fewer words too, quite succinctly (mumbles)

jolene555

sorry

WWSD

Well, I think Helen and JC on a stick (can I abbreviate it that way?) said it all.

I just want to reiterate that what you believe, if you state it out in the open, will be challanged. If you don't want that, you might want to check out another board where there are more like minded people about who will not bring up points contradictory to your beliefs.

I'm not saying that I or anyone else here wants you to leave. You are welcome to stay and you are welcome to make points and discuss things. But be warned that some of us have a bit more acid on our tongues than others, and that we will challange that which we don't agree with.

Another point I'd like to make here is that you should try to address points that were brought up against what you said if you want to have a reasonable discussion.

In any case, don't apologize just yet. You haven't really had (it seems) much experience with these boards. And jumping right in requires a bit of a thick hide if you are a theist in these parts.

Christian

For His own glory.

ISA 43:6 I will say to the north, `Give them up!'
and to the south, `Do not hold them back.'
Bring my sons from afar
and my daughters from the ends of the earth--
7 everyone who is called by my name,
whom I created for my glory,
whom I formed and made."

That is why He offers salvation.

ISA 43:25 "I, even I, am he who blots out
your transgressions, for my own sake,
and remembers your sins no more.

EPH 1:13 And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, 14 who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession--to the praise of his glory.

That is why He lingers until the day of judgment.

ISA 48:9 For my own name's sake I delay my wrath;
for the sake of my praise I hold it back from you,
so as not to cut you off.

That is the proper motivation for us in doing anything.

1CO 10:31 So whether you eat or drink or whatever you do, do it all for the glory of God.

In the end, all people (saved or condemned) will glorify God.

PHP 2:10 that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
11 and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord,
to the glory of God the Father.

Egocentric? It only seems that way because we think in human terms. God Himself is supremely valuable. He would be unrighteous (just as we would) if He valued anything more than what is supremely valuable. He is the one Being in the universe for whom self-exaltation is the highest virtue.

Respectfully,

Christian

WWSD

You provided a lot of scripture there but none to support your final argument.

How do you know the mind of god? I wonder because it seems that every theist seems to have a monopoly on what thier god is thinking.

Have you spoken directly with your god?

Also, scripture is no more than words to many atheists. It has no divine meaning or deep revelatory power.

Many of us have meditated on that same scripture for years, trying to believe or to find your god. So it really is an exercise in wasting page space.

If you want to bring scripture into the discussion in the future, I would suggest that you only quote the chapter and verse number, rather than the entire verse. We either will know what you are talking about, or we can very easily look it up.

Have a nice day!

Christian

WWSD,

I only know as much of the mind of God as He chooses to reveal to me (which admitedly is barely the tip of the iceberg.) The scriptures I posted do in fact describe God's motives. Even if you think they are "just words," they are "just words" that answer the question asked in this thread.

The point of all this, the reason God bothered is for the sake of His own glory. I'll take the scriptural answer to this question. You don't have to agree, of course.

I speak directly to God all the time. It's called "prayer."

What exactly do you mean that I have not provided scripture to support my final argument? Do you want a verse that says God is supremely valuable? Rev 5:12 will do. Do you want a verse that says it is virtuous for God to exhalt Himself? That is a necessary consequence of God being supremely valuable. Rev 5:12 works there as well.

And have a nice day yourself!

Respectfully,

Christian