Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Arrowman · 11-03-2002, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lunachick:
Heheh. I bet I just made one or two of you think ill of me. Too bad!

Not me, lunachick. Thanks for sharing that.

So - your Dad knows, and your Mum doesn't? Is that a difficult situation for him? I don't think I can imagine knowing something like that and keeping it from my wife, even if I did genuinely feel it was "for the best".

lunachick · 11-03-2002, 09:38 PM

My mum and dad aren't married to each other anymore and lead very seperate lives. Dad's new wife (new is now wife of about 15 years!) also knows and has no problem with it.

Arrowman · 11-03-2002, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Glory:
[/b]When I talk about a society that accepts prostitution, I am talking about a society very different from mine and, I suspect, yours. I envision a world with very different rules and attitudes about sex. If you remove the stigma attatched to casual sex, you have changed everything. One night stands need not be cause for concern anymore than going to a restaurant is if you change the prevailing attitude.

I don't have all the details of my imagined utopia fleshed out so I'll ask you to bear with me as I am having trouble writing all this down. Suffice to say that I think the prevailing attitudes about sex colour our perceptions so drastically, that it is difficult to imagine something as different as I propose. I am talking about doing away with the stigma attatched to sex. All of it. It's radical, I know.

Cool! I'm planning on winning the lottery some time, so I'll buy the island. (That is, the island will be "my shout"

) You bring the Manifesto; all Infidels welcome.

Glory · 11-03-2002, 09:45 PM

Deal!
I definately look forward to it.

Glory

Arrowman · 11-03-2002, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lunachick:
My mum and dad aren't married to each other anymore and lead very seperate lives. Dad's new wife (new is now wife of about 15 years!) also knows and has no problem with it.

Ah. My situation also - I could have gone on to say .... "if we were still living together". Apart, I can understand more readily.

lunachick · 11-03-2002, 11:48 PM

Incidentally, here are some questions and answers from the NZPC website.

Quote:

Will decriminalising prostitution mean more sex workers?
No. Evidence suggests that overall numbers do not increase-it is demand for services and social conditions which influence numbers. The Australian Capital Territory decriminalised many of its laws concerning prostitution in 1992. Police figures indicate that the numbers of people involved in sex work have remained almost the same. What may happen is an increase in smaller operations as the control exerted by the larger operators is diminished. This may result in more brothels, but not more sex workers.

Why not criminalise the clients instead?
It wouldn't work. In practice it would force sex workers to work in more dangerous ways and places, in order to protect their clients, who are the source of their income.
Kerb-crawling laws in Britain (which penalise street clients) have made things more difficult for street workers. they dare not take so long to assess the prospective client before joining him in his car. This increases the risk of assault.

Why not try to stamp out prostitution altogether?
It doesn't work. Criminal sanctions do not remove the sociological factors which motivate sex workers to enter the industry, nor do they prevent men from offering money for sex. Instead, the existing laws have the effect of increasing the vulnerability of sex workers by forcing them into a criminal sub-culture.

Won't the removal of current rules make it more difficult for police to control criminal activity in the sex industry?
Police have wide powers under the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975 to conduct searches for illegal drugs with or without a warrant. They can also search for firearms with or without a warrant. Since police also have wide powers of search with a warrant, it is unnecessary and unfair for a decriminalised sex industry to be subject to different conditions from any other industry.

Will this Bill protect against the spread of HIV and AIDS?
Yes. The existing laws encourage those operating massage parlours, escort agencies and other operators to take complicated precautions to hide evidence of the sexual purpose of the business. This includes an unwillingness to display safer sex literature and other products. Condoms have been used as evidence in brothel keeping cases.
New Zealand remains at risk of an escalation in HIV infections among the heterosexual population. More females have been diagnosed with HIV recently. In 1991 6% of the total number of people living with HIV were female. In 1997 this number had risen to 14%, and in 2000 to 23% (Source AIDS-New Zealand, issue 37 and 45).
Organisations like the New Zealand Prostitutes Collective find it difficult to educate sex workers who live a life underground and in hiding. The proposed law changes will remove legal impediments to the creation of a safer environment and will reduce potential risks to public health.

Will this Bill mean sex workers soliciting outside churches and schools?
Some overseas jurisdictions use controls such as zoning regulations to restrict the geographical areas in which brothels and escort agencies operate. The aim of many of these controls is to prevent brothels and escort agencies from operating in areas close to schools and churches.
Sex workers are motivated to work in areas where clients will be. Clients are unlikely to make themselves available in areas where they could be identified. Equally, the majority of people who work in the sex industry prefer to work behind closed doors without publicly drawing attention to themselves.
Street work has long been restricted to known "red light" districts, e.g. Vivian Street in Wellington, Manchester Street in Christchurch and Karangahape Road in Auckland. It is likely that the number of street workers would decline if soliciting was decriminalised because other safer options would become available.
The issue of zoning is complicated by the established existence of brothels in close proximity to schools and churches, particularly in commercial business districts. This seems to be widely accepted. The existing controls by local city councils would appear to be the best method of designating areas in which the industry may operate. Any attempt to include nationally applicable criteria in legislation may run counter to existing operation and rules in district plans under the resource Management Act 1991 to control the adverse effect of activities on the environment. For this reason provision for zoning will not be included in the Bill.

11-04-2002, 03:53 AM

Heheh. I bet I just made one or two of you think ill of me. Too bad!

Definitely not me.

livius drusus · 11-04-2002, 04:40 AM

lunachick -

You are just too cool for school, babe.

galiel · 11-04-2002, 05:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by livius drusus:
lunachick -

You are just too cool for school, babe.

What she done said.

Derec · 11-04-2002, 05:15 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Douglas J. Bender:
If sex is intended to be an intimate sharing of two people, uniting them in a physical manner which reflects the uniting of their hearts in love, then prostitution is immoral, as is any sex outside of marriage.

So prostitution is equally immoral as sex outside marriage?
I have nothing against premarital sex, does that mean I should have no reservations about visiting a prostitute?

Just asking ...

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11-03-2002, 09:38 PM	#52
lunachick Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: NZ Posts: 7,895	My mum and dad aren't married to each other anymore and lead very seperate lives. Dad's new wife (new is now wife of about 15 years!) also knows and has no problem with it.

11-03-2002, 09:45 PM	#54
Glory Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: b Posts: 673	Deal! I definately look forward to it. Glory

11-04-2002, 03:53 AM	#57
Divide et Impera Guest Posts: n/a	Heheh. I bet I just made one or two of you think ill of me. Too bad! Definitely not me.

11-04-2002, 04:40 AM	#58
livius drusus Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Selva Oscura Posts: 4,120	lunachick - You are just too cool for school, babe.

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