Freethought & Rationalism Archive

GeoTheo · 07-26-2002, 10:21 AM

If defeating YEC arguements disproves the existence of the God, does defeating ID arguements disprove the existence of space aliens?

MrDarwin · 07-26-2002, 10:25 AM

Who says that defeating YEC arguments disproves the existence of God? The only thing it disproves is a particular interpretation of the Old Testament.

Darwin's Finch · 07-26-2002, 10:26 AM

Uh, no. Why would it?

GeoTheo · 07-26-2002, 10:27 AM

I know I don't think it does either, but I think some people do.

Mageth · 07-26-2002, 10:34 AM

I've seen people argue that disproving the first three chapters of Genesis invalidates Original Sin, the need for Christ's sacrifice, and at least some of Christ's teaching (e.g. he mentioned A&E). And thus disproves the existence of at least some people's version the Christian God. I've even heard xian creationists say that Genesis creation must be true, and that xians must believe in Genesis creation and not in evolution for this very reason.

I can see at least some validity to that argument, although there are xians who believe in evolution and think that Genesis creation is a myth or fable, so at least they are able to work around the problem.

But in general, disproving any particular religious text doesn't disprove the existence of god(s).

[ July 26, 2002: Message edited by: Mageth ]

pz · 07-26-2002, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by GeoTheo:
If defeating YEC arguements disproves the existence of the God, does defeating ID arguements disprove the existence of space aliens?

Naturalism and evolution do not "disprove" god or aliens. All they do is make those hypotheses unnecessary.

Starboy · 07-26-2002, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by pz:


Naturalism and evolution do not "disprove" god or aliens. All they do is make those hypotheses unnecessary.

Hi pz,

That statement sounds innocent enough, but if you are a truth monger and your empire of belief is built on a mountain of truth, it can have dire consequences. You wakeup one morning and your mountain is gone! And where does that leave you? In thin air!

Starboy

[ July 26, 2002: Message edited by: Starboy ]

GeoTheo · 07-26-2002, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mageth:
I've even heard xian creationists say that
Genesis creation must be true, and that xians must believe in Genesis creation and not in evolution for this
very reason.]

Kind of setting themselves up for someone to be able to disprove the existence of God.

Albion · 07-26-2002, 11:22 AM

Quote:

If defeating YEC arguements disproves the existence of the God, does defeating ID arguements disprove the existence of space aliens?

No, but the space aliens are just red herrings anyway in the ID world. In the world they envisage, where ID has taken over from that nasty materialist evolution, space aliens will be about as welcome as "random chance."

Bubba · 07-26-2002, 01:53 PM

Amazing how ID always seems to lead back to a more and more conservative Christian view of the world than a scientific view, at least in terms of the people who promote it. The best arguement against it is that it adds no theoretical value to the scientific arguement about origins. If we could just make people understand that much, we'd have a chance...

I'd suggest reading "the Uplift War" by David Brin for a fictional look at what the universe might be like if life really was somehow perhaps seeded here by aliens...

Bubba

07-26-2002, 10:21 AM	#1
GeoTheo Veteran Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Bemidji Posts: 1,197	Question If defeating YEC arguements disproves the existence of the God, does defeating ID arguements disprove the existence of space aliens?

07-26-2002, 10:34 AM	#5
Mageth Contributor Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Deep in the heart of mother-lovin' Texas Posts: 29,689	I've seen people argue that disproving the first three chapters of Genesis invalidates Original Sin, the need for Christ's sacrifice, and at least some of Christ's teaching (e.g. he mentioned A&E). And thus disproves the existence of at least some people's version the Christian God. I've even heard xian creationists say that Genesis creation must be true, and that xians must believe in Genesis creation and not in evolution for this very reason. I can see at least some validity to that argument, although there are xians who believe in evolution and think that Genesis creation is a myth or fable, so at least they are able to work around the problem. But in general, disproving any particular religious text doesn't disprove the existence of god(s). [ July 26, 2002: Message edited by: Mageth ]</p>

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07-26-2002, 10:25 AM	#2
MrDarwin Veteran Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 4,140	Who says that defeating YEC arguments disproves the existence of God? The only thing it disproves is a particular interpretation of the Old Testament.

07-26-2002, 10:26 AM	#3
Darwin's Finch Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Gardnerville, NV Posts: 666	Uh, no. Why would it?

07-26-2002, 10:27 AM	#4
GeoTheo Veteran Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Bemidji Posts: 1,197	I know I don't think it does either, but I think some people do.

07-26-2002, 01:53 PM	#10
Bubba Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Orient, OH USA Posts: 1,501	Amazing how ID always seems to lead back to a more and more conservative Christian view of the world than a scientific view, at least in terms of the people who promote it. The best arguement against it is that it adds no theoretical value to the scientific arguement about origins. If we could just make people understand that much, we'd have a chance... I'd suggest reading "the Uplift War" by David Brin for a fictional look at what the universe might be like if life really was somehow perhaps seeded here by aliens... Bubba

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