bonduca

*wonders how to tell matt that his screename is especially annoying...*

DarkBronzePlant

Okay, I'll withhold from moving this thread, based solely on your sheer perseverence. But let's not make it a habit folks, eh?

So while I am posting, I'll throw in my 2 cents. I agree in part with mmmmv. A person presenting an argument should consider that their points may be better received and understood by a wider audience if that person makes an effort to speak in a manner that's well easy to understand (circular logic I know, but you get the point.) That is, if the point of posting is truly to try to educate and convince others of your point--rather than to say "see how smart I am!" Indeed it is an effort to "dumb down" your tone while still presenting the information you hope to present (I think among others, scigirl usually manages to strike this balance well.)

That being said, people have their own style of communication, and is just so happens that some people just come out "sounding like college professors." And if I might go out on a limb, I'd venture to say that on this site, the intelligence level tends to be higher than average, so we'd tend to find a disproportionately high number of such folks here.

And I second the people who have already said that, perhaps, there is an intrinsic value in reading some posts that sound "college professor"-ish. mattmattmattmattv, you seem to be able to distinguish between bullshitters who are just trying to sound smart, and truly intellegent posters. Why not simply discard the former, and take on the latter as a challenge?

Synaesthesia

I think, in my case at least, matt has something of a point, although he's a little unsympathetic to sincere pedants.

Language and metaphor are tools of thought. That's the way human beings work, we don't go from pure thought and make language and metaphor out of it, there is a constant and inescapable interplay.

Now I am quite sure that there are clearer ways of saying much of what I say. What you must understand is that what I say is quite tangled up in the tangled manner in which I think.

To speak more simply, in my case, would take more intelligence and skill than I have right now. Only as I acquire language skills will I be able to communicate difficult thoughts in simple and clear language. Until then, I cannot help but obfuscate the obtuse if my limited mind is ever to quash quandaries.

Pretentiously yours,
Synaesthesia

Samhain

It's really annoying when people post complaints regarding the posting methods of others and use of mathematical and philosophical logic in their posts on a forum called Existence of God(s).

Secular Pinoy

mmmmv, you must note that some posters here are non-native english speakers. English is just my second language, and the way it's taught in school, I may indeed come out sounding a bit awkward.

banditoloco, why don't you try <a href="http://www.wordweb.co.uk/" target="_blank">http://www.wordweb.co.uk/</a> . It's a free dictionary program that can be launched as a stand alone, or integrates with MS Word.

Jobar

So you think it is possible to discuss the fine points of philosophy, physics, and theology in words of one syllable?

I agree that it's not uncommon to see people here attempting to use big words to conceal the fact that they don't actually know what the hell they are talking about. But since there are lots and lots of people here who *do* have large vocabularies, and an exact understanding of what these words mean, the people attempting this sort of clumsiness are rapidly booed and heckled off the stage, often under a bombardment of rotten fruit.

I suggest that you increase your own vocabulary, so that you too can be one of the ones helping assure the proper use of our admittedly complex language.

Synaesthesia

I frankly think people come down too hard on the misuse of 'advanced vocabulary', this sort of thing is especially absurd when it comes to pronunciation.

I think this is part of the reason people hesitate to experiment with expanding their vocabulary. The same snobs who come down on those who are still learning contribute to the very degradation of language that they decry.

[ July 24, 2002: Message edited by: Synaesthesia ]</p>

mattmattmattmattv

Sorry, I was not aware.

OF COURSE my problem was not with people who "sound like college professors," but with people who try to show off a college professor-like vocabulary that they do not, in fact, have. I don't care what level you are able to write at, but write at that level! People are yelling at me for coming down too hard on people with smaller vocabularies or people for whom English is a second language. That was not the case at all--quite the opposite. It bothers me when people refuse to admit to themselves and to others their own limitations in writing ability. I myself am not exceptionally intelligent, which is precisely why I do not talk as though I am. Sure, the really smart people do need to work on condescending to those less intelligent, like myself, but what I was really talking about was the people like myself who fail to communicate by trying to use words and concepts that they do not fully understand. They are a minority, for sure. And THEY are the ones who need to use a dictionary, not me--a dictionary will not help me if the person using the word uses it improperly.

matt

P.S. -- Pls. call me matt

Samhain

1. To whom are you referring?
2. If you are are not "exceptionally intelligent" then how can you differentiate between those who aren't and those who are?
3. Is college-professor-like-vocabulary an objective quality?
4. How can you judge the intelligence and supposed grammatical limitations of a person off of a few posts?
5. Being as the internet is generally anonymous, how are you able to determine that many of the posters here do not have the necessary education to use their "big words" to full extent of their heart's desire?
6. Expanding one's vocabulary and increasing one's grammatical prowess has mainly to do with writing and using new words in context to better portray the ideas that they have as words on paper (and in many cases here they are highly logical and highly abstract ideas, requiring the upmost levels of clarity in order to get the point across in the correct fashion). Would you hamper the abilities of these person's to correctly portray their views by placing limitations on their grammar and vocabulary and run the possible risk of going through pages of posts in order to express their true thoughts or opinions on far simpler matters?
7. What evidence do you have to support your assertion that the infidels here only use "big words" in order to intimidate theists in some way?
8. Have you ever considered that the reason that you think that people are using terms improperly may be because you do not understand the terms or how to use them yourself?
9. Once again, why the hell did you put this thread on the Existence of God(s) forum?
10. Do you plan on addressing any of the points that others or I have brought up concerning your objections, or do you plan on staying silent?

In very rare cases, yes, there may be some people (even infidels ) who use certain terms improperly, but it is so far and in between IMO that it hardly even warrants notice, let alone a thread dedicated to that point alone. For the most part people understand the terms and use them properly and in context to the said discussion. If you wish to assert otherwise, try providing a little thing called evidence.

The dictionary still stands as the most valuable tool for you in this concern. Get it, use it, love it.

DMB

There is an underlying problem here about what is perceived as normal language. I am a 62-year-old Englishwoman (Oxford alumna)and I simply don't know much about any sort of American teenspeak. I don't find that it is usually a bar to my understanding of posts in II, where I am relieved to find that most people use something more or less recognisable as standard English.

Technical terms, where necessary, are an aid to communication and are more accessible to non-Americans (whether native English speakers or not) than many slang expressions.

If, however, a teenager decides to post something in the latest cool argot, I really don't mind. I may simply decide it's not worth while my struggling with it. But none of us reads everything anyway.