Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Philosoft · 01-04-2003, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by High Ideologue

The infinite divine eternal one is extreme in dimensions of quantity of energy, quality of space, longevity, and denominator of continuum. George is limited in his dimensions. The emotive forces of sorrow, fear, and anger produced by the discovery of probable dimensions of seed body and self may be far stronger than emotive forces of joy; faith and love produce by the mystery of possible dimensions of soul spirit and world. I compensate for this inequality. Probable dimensions I describe as limited and possible dimensions I describe as limitless. In this way, I amplify the emotive forces produced by the mystery of possible dimensions to balance the emotive forces produced by discovery of probable dimensions. No such amplification is possible with George. Both are myth and fantasy based on mystery. For me and others who agree with me, my belief in the extreme one produces the most powerful emotional responses of glad happiness imaginable. George simply doesn't cut it as a emotive balance to the extreme negativity of the death sentence that hangs over all of us like a sword of Damocles.

You know, you could have just said, "I believe in God because I'm afraid of dying and God makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside."

Eudaimonist · 01-04-2003, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Asha'man:
Oh, and a friendly suggestion: if you want to live in a world of myth and fantasy, don�t try to use science to justify it.

High Ideologue's reply:
I want to live in a world of truth and knowledge based on discovery that best produces health and myth and fantasy based on mystery that best produces happiness. Health and happiness are synergistic. Yet you want to take my happiness away to make me more healthy. That makes sense in the mind of a sadistic predator.

Don't you think you are overreacting? He didn't say that he wanted to take away your myth and fantasy. If you want to believe in the reality of myth and fantasy, that's fine. However, you won't impress anyone here by trying to cloak myth and fantasy in science. That won't wash.

If it bothers you to have your myth and fantasy challenged, I wouldn't advise you to speak to scientifically literate people. They tend to call others on bullshit.

Rousseau_CHN · 01-05-2003, 12:02 AM

I guess it's just me, since you've all find this thread very interesting, guessing by the numbers who participated in it.

I, on the other hand, find the title very insulting. (Insulting may not be the right word, but, you see, my vocabulary is very limited.)

A Question For Atheists

Why? Why are you centering the question on us (or me)?

It is an atheist forum, if anything, it is an atheist that questions theist, and not the other way around.

Should you find yellow wallpaper in you host's purple living room, you do not question his taste, or do you?

It's just rude, that's it, just rude.

seebs · 01-05-2003, 12:08 AM

ChristianForums is full of newbies who aren't Christian and want to ask the Christians questions. Seems very reasonable to me; people who want to know more about atheists should ask them questions, right? And they should do it... where atheists hang out, perhaps?

I think you're just being touchy.

Rousseau_CHN · 01-05-2003, 12:21 AM

maybe...but should the title be that blunt?

Supposing I attend a Christian Prayer Rally (you might not have this in your part of the world), will I ever come out alive if I question their faith?

In the same way that there is a time for everything, there should also be a place for everything.

Rousseau_CHN · 01-05-2003, 12:25 AM

...just believe this belongs to the ~elsewhere~ section or the Rants and Ravings.

Quote:

Are you willing to admit there is a God

This statement seems to fit the prolystizing criteria.

seebs · 01-05-2003, 12:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rousseau_CHN
maybe...but should the title be that blunt?

Supposing I attend a Christian Prayer Rally (you might not have this in your part of the world), will I ever come out alive if I question their faith?

In the same way that there is a time for everything, there should also be a place for everything.

Dunno about a prayer rally, but an "open discussion forum", sure.

I'm not saying the question was a good one, but "a question for atheists" seems like a good description of a question to which one would like to hear the answers of atheists.

High Ideologue · 01-05-2003, 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Eudaimonist
Don't you think you are overreacting?

No I do not think I am overreacting. I am acting in the way that is right for me.

Quote:

He didn't say that he wanted to take away your myth and fantasy.

You are right. That sentence could be rephrased as a question: Do you want to take away my happiness to make me more healthy? However if I followed the totality of his advice then the effect would be 'to take away my myth and fantasy'. However, I agree with you that it is important to read and interpret ideas others say with care so that these ideas are accurately represented in any reply that may be made. I can only speculate about his desire with respect to my health and happiness.

Quote:

If you want to believe in the reality of myth and fantasy, that's fine. However, you won't impress anyone here by trying to cloak myth and fantasy in science. That won't wash.

I build myth and fantasy based on mystery that for me best produces the most powerful emotional responses of happiness imaginable. I build truth and knowledge based on discovery that best produces the most powerful responses of health possible. I combine truth and myth, knowledge and fantasy, discovery and mystery to form a model of self and world that best produces health and happiness. Now if myth and fantasy based on mystery contradicts truth and knowledge based on discovery then it is lies and ignorance based on denial. I eliminate lies and ignorance based on denial from my model of self and world. To do so requires that I use truth and knowledge based on discovery to test myth and fantasy based on mystery.

Quote:

If it bothers you to have your myth and fantasy challenged, I wouldn't advise you to speak to scientifically literate people. They tend to call others on bullshit.

I like being called on 'bullshit'. I like it because, it creates for me an opportunity to change. Every criticism is a learning experience that I can grow from and renew my wealth of information about self and world.

beyelzu · 01-05-2003, 01:29 AM

you know, everytime i here or read the word faith, i automatically think the word theist. faith is a word that has no place in the vocabulary of an atheist or agnostic.

also dark matter is detectable thats why there is a theory about it. high idealogue you need a god. and your weakness holds you back. you might be too logical to actually be a theist but you want to be

beyelzu · 01-05-2003, 01:46 AM

you know i must admit that i quit reading high idealogue's post, i can only stand his new age mysticism bullshit for so long. plus his constant advertisement for his cult's bible is pretty irritating. while i do find skimming his post to be quite amusing( also i apologize for the profanity but sometimes the only applicable word is bullshit), i just cant go on because i am laughing to hard. and its getting hard to type.

also, i love how he keeps telling everyone that yes they are right.

ps idealogue can i please join your cult, i really want to sell everything i own and move to a compound. as a bonus i already shave my head and would be perfectly willing to sacrifice several family members to the divine self in us all or whatever the name of your kooky god is.

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01-05-2003, 12:02 AM	#73
Rousseau_CHN Banned Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Nowhere Land Posts: 441	I guess it's just me, since you've all find this thread very interesting, guessing by the numbers who participated in it. I, on the other hand, find the title very insulting. (Insulting may not be the right word, but, you see, my vocabulary is very limited.) A Question For Atheists Why? Why are you centering the question on us (or me)? It is an atheist forum, if anything, it is an atheist that questions theist, and not the other way around. Should you find yellow wallpaper in you host's purple living room, you do not question his taste, or do you? It's just rude, that's it, just rude.

01-05-2003, 12:08 AM	#74
seebs Contributor Join Date: May 2002 Location: Saint Paul, MN Posts: 24,524	ChristianForums is full of newbies who aren't Christian and want to ask the Christians questions. Seems very reasonable to me; people who want to know more about atheists should ask them questions, right? And they should do it... where atheists hang out, perhaps? I think you're just being touchy.

01-05-2003, 12:21 AM	#75
Rousseau_CHN Banned Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Nowhere Land Posts: 441	maybe...but should the title be that blunt? Supposing I attend a Christian Prayer Rally (you might not have this in your part of the world), will I ever come out alive if I question their faith? In the same way that there is a time for everything, there should also be a place for everything.

01-05-2003, 01:29 AM	#79
beyelzu Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: the peach state ga I am a metaphysical naturalist Posts: 2,869	you know, everytime i here or read the word faith, i automatically think the word theist. faith is a word that has no place in the vocabulary of an atheist or agnostic. also dark matter is detectable thats why there is a theory about it. high idealogue you need a god. and your weakness holds you back. you might be too logical to actually be a theist but you want to be

01-05-2003, 01:46 AM	#80
beyelzu Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: the peach state ga I am a metaphysical naturalist Posts: 2,869	you know i must admit that i quit reading high idealogue's post, i can only stand his new age mysticism bullshit for so long. plus his constant advertisement for his cult's bible is pretty irritating. while i do find skimming his post to be quite amusing( also i apologize for the profanity but sometimes the only applicable word is bullshit), i just cant go on because i am laughing to hard. and its getting hard to type. also, i love how he keeps telling everyone that yes they are right. ps idealogue can i please join your cult, i really want to sell everything i own and move to a compound. as a bonus i already shave my head and would be perfectly willing to sacrifice several family members to the divine self in us all or whatever the name of your kooky god is.

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