aach

If you believe in god then you must believe that god wants you to act as if He did not exist (or He'd provide some evidence).

So, irrespective of belief you should act as if god does not exist. If your acting as if god does not exist then your belief becomes irrelevant.

I wasted many years as a believer and a couple more as an anti-clericalist before I recognised this. Religeon is totaly irrational but relativly harmless.

JEST2ASK

I beg to differ (IMO) ..... Religion leads many people to do harmful things to themselves and others ..... Even the most benign and liberal forms have a cost. Even if you only consider lost potential ... Belevers are compelled to to put their faith into action .... The Pet Physic and Crossing Over are relatively harmless .....

Magus55

Speak for yourself, God matters more to me than any human ever could. You may not think you need God, and that's your choice, but don't go saying everyone else is irrational and their beliefs are pointless.

5+ Billion people believe in some kind of god, so apparently you are the minority and the one considered irrational.

Luiseach

Do you have any evidence for this statement?

Jobar

Welcome, aach.

The problem is that either theists claim 1) there *is* evidence of God (which we skeptics either refuse to see or can not see) or 2) you don't need evidence to believe God exists (presuppositionalism).

If, as Jest2ask points out, believers did not act in destructive, tyrannical, or insane ways as a consequence of their belief, then yes, religion would be 'mostly harmless'. But remember Sept. 11.

Tell me, Magus55- are you still claiming there is evidence in the real world which is unambiguous proof of God's existence?

Magus55

Well according to adherents.com, there are about 4.2 billion people who follow either Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, and Buddhism. Considering there are like 30+ thousand religions in the world, i'd say there are at least 800 million people who believe in some god outside the 4 biggest religions.

Or you could say since there are approximately 900 million atheists/agnostics in the world, and over 6 billion people, that atleast 5 billion believe in some kind of religious aspect.

Magus55

Is there evidence to prove God's existence? According to billions of people yes, is it unambiguous? Probably not - thats where faith comes in.

philechat

Just for your information, many Buddhists have no beliefs in a deity. There are also several atheistic sects under the umbrella of Hinduism (the Upanishads, for example). Both religions are more philosophically diverse than Christianity, and less categorizable.

Luiseach

Justification for belief in anything at all through either consensus or faith doesn't seem very reliable, wouldn't you agree?

Luiseach

Whoops, missed this post.

Thank you for the information....I'll check it out.

But as philechat rightly pointed out, 'many Buddhists have no beliefs in a deity. There are also several atheistic sects under the umbrella of Hinduism.'

Out of interest, at adherents.com, does it specify what is meant by 'following a religion'?