abe smith

BAX: you don't seem to be communicating anything that i'm able to receive as meaningful. Would you consider taking-gup modern dance or painting in oils? you might have more success in reaching some audience? Abe

K

Trebaxian Vir:

The state is formed from our desire to create it.

Desire causes suffering and suffering is evil.

Nothing good can be created from evil.

Therefore, the state is evil.

Calvan

Dear Abe,
Do I detect sarcasm?

Calvan

HaysooChreesto!

The fallacy is the initial premise that suffering comes from desire. A skeptic can twist any words (in this case "desire" and "suffering") as much as they wish, but it will always corrupt their premise and therefore invalidate their theories. Simplistic, but I don't have any more time.

Edited to include the word "suffering".

[ November 13, 2002: Message edited by: Lamma ]</p>

DigitalDruid

Lady Anoteros,
Rejecting all kinds of desire in toto might lead to a paradox here:
Since all desire is bad, logically no one should desire to lead their life according to what you have written!
How do you explain that?

Or what about this:
I desire money, so I borrow - which is bad.
But now I have no desire to return the money - which is good?

For some historical perspective, what you have written sounds like the classical ethical theory of Cynicism which holds that all fruits of civilization are worthless and hence we should not desire them. Salvation can be found only in the personal sense by living like an ascetic.

Cynicism was popular during the extreme turmoil of crumbling political and social order in Greece. Many people found it attractive to withdraw from society which had become chaotic, and strive for personal salvation by leading an ascetic'c life. The otherworldliness emphasized by Cynicism was a major influence on christianity, which saw monasteries and nunneries spread far and wide. Cynicism also suited christianity because of its emphasis of personal salvation.

Calvan

Lady Anoteros,

You write:
“And since suffering is not desirable or desired, the cause of suffering is bad.”

Please state how you know bad exists and then tell me what it is. Thanks.
Calvan