Family Man

Gosh, Jews work for decades to reestablish their homeland based on their belief that their holy book demanded -- and it's not a self-fulfilling prophecy! Amazing.

Then, surprise! Arabs attack the newly formed Israel and surprise! Israel wins! Gosh, it must be God!

I suggest you check your historical facts. The Israeli army has long been considered the best in the region for decades (hence their easy victories). Only the '48 war could be considered surprising, but I don't recall any divine intervention being reported.

IOW, the formation of Israel is a self-fulfilling prophecy. The strong military developed by Israel -- aided by the West -- is also self-fulfilling (what did you expect them to do, become flower children?) and hence, their subsequent victories were also self-fulfilling.

Tell me, Magus, where in the Bible does it predict that Israel will be reformed after millions are killed by a madman?

Spaz

If that was a prophecy, then I would be impressed.

Magus you give off the same feeling that a lot of christians do, that humans can accomplish nothing, only god can. Those people had to fight to get what they have and you give them no credit. I give up.

Magus55

Right back at ya.

Magus55

Its one thing to accomplish something, its another to fight off a superior army, when the Israelis had none in the beginning, and have it just coincidentially happen just like the Bible said 3000 years ago.

Considering the majority of the world through history has hated Jews, including constant fighting and terrorism from arab nations surrounding Israel, and then genocide from Hitler killing 1/4 of the modern Jewish population ( there are only 15 million Jews in the world, about 5 million people in Israel right now compared to the massive massive more in the surrounding Arab countries), Israel and the Jews there shouldn't exist.

Here is an interesting statement taken from the world book encyclopedia about the first arab-israeli war:

"Troops from Egypt, Iraq, Lebanon, Syria, and Jordan invaded Israel on May 15, 1948. The Israelis were greatly outnumbered and poorly armed, but they halted the invaders. They defeated the Arabs by the end of 1948, and controlled about half the land that the UN had planned for the new Arab State." Exactly as God said it would happen. If you actually think Israel had any chance to win that war against 5 other countries when Israeli only had like 2 or 3 million people in the entire country back then, can i sell you the Brooklyn Bridge? Sorry that is divine intervention. Israel should have not survived that even according to the Encyclopedia. How could Israel have possibly self-fullfilled that prophecy? Asked the 5 invading Arab nations to kill themselves so Israel would win? Israel says, " Oh hi guys, like i know you have like 10 times the army and weaponry as us, and we have like no chance, but could you like kill a bunch of yourselves and retreat so we can fulfill this biblical prophecy?" Arabs say, "Oh sure no problem, we'll get right on it".

Get real, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize this was a fullfilled prophecy. Atheists are just so bent on disproving it they will say the most assanine things to make themselves look smart.

Apikorus

Czech armaments, American Reform Jewish dollars, and secular Jewish fighters brought about the modern state of Israel. Triple-treif!

Still no Davidic ruler or Temple in Jerusalem...

Biblical prophecy is a bit like the Brazilian economy. It's always about to come around.

Magus55

Who said all prophecies are fulfilled already? Jesus has more prophecies he will fullfill at his second coming including ruling the world for 1000 years and restoring the Temple of Jerusalem.

Dominus Paradoxum

You do realize, I hope, that the majority of those who persecuted the Jews throught the centuries were CHRISTIAN, including hitler. He drew on all the hatred and antisemitism that had been handed ever since the earliest days of christianity. The only difference is that he was much worse than his predecessors.

Dominus Paradoxum

And while we're on the subject of prophecy, here's one Christian "prophecy" demolished:

Isaiah 7:14 - Did Isaiah forsee the virgin birth?

The "prophecy" occurs in Matthew 1:23

Note: The Rabbi says that Matthew deliberately mistranslated the hebrew word "ha'almah" to mean virgin, but that's not true. Matthew actually pulled the quote from the Septuagint, a greek translation of the Hebrew scriptures, the greek word being ambiguous betweeen "virgin" and "young woman". Neverthess, I think the fact that Matthew's attepted "prophecy" is based on a misreading of the original is enough to show, at least, that his gospel is certainly not infallible.

Apikorus

They say that Trotsky was the most far-seeing of all the communist thinkers, because his predictions have yet to come true.

Vorkosigan

'Pik! For Christ's sake, stick around and quit lurking! Where have you been hiding?

Hey! Have you heard anything recently about that silly ossuary?

Vorkosigan