The Other Michael

In an MF&P thread there was a reference to "superstitious religions". That made me wonder if it would be possible to create a non-superstitious, or rational, religion.

If a religion requires a supernatural aspect, then I'd think not. Some people might think that secular humanism might qualify as a rational religion, but I see it as more of an ethical system, since religion would seem to require a dogma of some sort.

Any thoughts on this?

cheers,
Michael

Starbug

My general definition for religion is a cultural manifestation of superstitious dogma, founded upon hearsay.

I suppose one could be "spiritual," using a liberal definition, and still be rational.

Humanism doesn't seem to fall into spiritual or religious categories to me. To me it's just striving for optimum human civility (perhaps influenced by an individual's spirituality).

Llyricist

Considering that this:
A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion.

is one of the defintions of religion... I should say that it is possible for a rational religion to exist

I ate Pascal's Wafer

Well, yeah, but that would also make things like soccer or NASCAR religions as well. While necessary, I don't think that is a sufficient condition for defining "religion".

-Nick

Llyricist

Are you seriously suggesting that soccer and NASCAR aren't treated exactly as religions by some people?

Secular Pinoy

Llyricist, Do you yourself, using the criteria/definition that you posted above, believe that soccer and nascar are religions?

Llyricist

to some people, yes indeed they are religions in the sense of that definition. When definitions are in question, all bets are off.

I should say that although my father was an atheist, he also considered himselfvery religious, using that very definition, though his religious beliefs were all based on reason and reproduceable evidence.

The point is, there is nothing automatically and intrisicly irrational or non-atheist in the word religion.

Atheist is a lack of belief in god or gods. rationality is conneced to reason. Religion is a set of beliefs hel strongly. nothing mutually exclusive in any of those definitions.

The Other Michael

I find it curious that you dropped so far down in the definition (from dictionary.com) for the part you picked:


1 a Belief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe.
b A personal or institutionalized system grounded in such belief and worship.
2 The life or condition of a person in a religious order.
3 A set of beliefs, values, and practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader.
4 A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion.


The first and most common usage certainly seems to have an element of "superstition".

#3 would seem to hold some possibility for a rational religion, though that may depend on the definition of "spiritual" that is used.

cheers,
Michael

Llyricist

does the fact that it is on the bottom of the list make it any less valid? As far as I know it only makes it less common or a more recent usage. Actually if you look up "bitch" the first definition is probably the LEAST common usage LOL (but yes, most archaic)

Radcliffe Emerson

To me, 'rational' and 'religion' are extreme opposites. No compromise is possible.