_|ason

Hi Everyone

I'm not sure how many South Africans frequent IIDB, so comments from anyone are welcome, but I'd be particularly interested in feedback from those who live in South Africa.

In 1996 South Africa adopted a new constitution (arguably one of the best in the world). One of the items in the constitution that I am impressed with is the separation of church/State, as well as the right to freedom of religion, or not to be religious at all.

South Africa is a now a secular state, but one thing that strikes me as unusual is that our three national anthems (yes, we have *three*, due to keeping two from the apartheid days...) still make references to 'God', 'Almighty', being blessed, etc.

In fact, the newest Anthem, translated into English, even begins with 'God Bless Africa'.

Pardon me if I'm nit picking here, but surely this is not acceptable in light of the fact that the constitution guarantees that no religion will be given preference?

As far as I know, no one has spoken out against this. As an agnostic atheist, the concept of 'God watching over our country' is slightly offensive to me, since it is my belief that such a being does not exist. People wonder why I'm unpatriotic because I choose not to sing the anthems, when in actual fact, it's simply because I'm not religious!

Any thoughts on this?

never been there

In Canada, the original lyrics to our national anthem are French, and contain religious references to the cross and faith. I don't mind them, because it is an old song (from 1840something?) that reflects history. The English lyrics never had any religious references until a prime minister wanted to placate some MPs from conservative parts of the country, and the rest were too afraid of offending religious constituents (because people vote against, not for candidates). In that context, it bothers me. Those weren't the words I learned as a child.

The official South African national anthem is great in that it takes four languages to get through it, and has a full four-part arrangement. WOW! We have a senator that is trying to do the same thing with our national anthem - to create an official bilingual version - funny how his version is not the one sung at hockey games, but does manage to keep the god references to a minimum!

Bearing in mind I'm a foreigner, I think Nkosi Sikeleli is a wonderful piece of music, goes back many years, and is, after all, a hymn. I can't grasp enough Afrikaans to understand Die Stem, but I think it's fairly old. The English part just doesn't resonate with me, it sounds like generic national anthem words.

I sing along with Bach, and I have even learned the Xhosa and Sotho words to Nkosi Sikeleli! I don't worry about "inherited" religious references, in short; I get annoyed when someone tries to impose new ones. Would that be an approach you could live with?

_|ason

Quite frankly, I don't think South Africa can keep their current national anthems as they are, whether the tunes are 'catchy' or not. I think the words must actually mean something, even though most people just mumble them anyway!

While I'm not HIGHLY offended at the God references, I am still somewhat offended that we should be singing about a magic sky-pixie looking out for us. This country has managed to eradicate a lot of bad 'inherited' things, and being a secular nation, I think *all* the God references should be eliminated. Can't we sing about some of the good things that people have done/should be doing, rather than what God should be doing?