Infinity Lover

I'm having another go at trying to get some feedback on this one. Simply put I took the ancient questions that spawned religion, What happens to us when we die? Where did it all come from? Why are we here? What is life? etc., and started re-answering myself. One thing I think is extraordinary, is how the Q&A's work in couples, and there's a logical order to place them in.
I wonder who else this baffles.

On the one hand the concept of soul/afterlife/deity is filtered out, on the other hand the answers are based on the principle of existence being absolutely infinite. The answers are the product of logicality rather than personal ideology, and I think they make a world of difference.
If I'm a nutcase for using these answers as a moral basis... what would a world full of nutcases like me look like, and would that be a bad thing?

Here's the logical couples and topics they tackle...
Logical pairs of knowledge! and choice? 1+2=limitation!&potential? 3+4=source!&destination? 5+6=identity!&purpose? 7+8=awareness!&responsibility? 9+10=method!&process?
(levels of devolpment: 1+2:fear and desire 3+4: wish and wonder 5+6:search and ask 7+8: comprehend and become 9+10: apply and find) (matters of the concience: 1+2 lifevalue 3+4: sense of reality 5+6:relationship 7+8:selfknowledge 9+10:attitude)

The specific formulation of these answers is a personal choice of words, the logic they're based on isn't (that would require more elaborate explaination; working on a website to deal with that, but I'm willing and able to answers questions). Absolute infinity ---nothing=nothing.
Nothing doesn't exist, so there's always something!--- If an answer makes sense... chances are that's because it doesn't contradict logic.

(lifeValue)
1.What happens to us when we die? Perfection doesn't exist. Everything and everyone has limitations. Everything that begins comes to an end, but within that limitation there's boundless potential. When you die your life ends!
(Everything infinity consists of is limited, something limited isn't perfect by definition)

2. Is there a certain part of us that lives on, after we die? Yes; the way in which we are remembered, and everything that we bring forth. It's the bit of history we write and share with others, and it's up to us to make that into a beautiful and valuable thing. Our legacy lives on after we end!
(you can't have two infinite's; so much for eternal souls)

(Sense of reality; all we ever experience is our brains interpretation of reality. It helps to know what it's an interpretation of)
3. Where did it all come from? Everything that exists is part of existence. Nothing doesn't exist, so there's always something, always has been, and always wil be. Infinity exists, so existence is infinite! Don't try to understand everything; just understand what everything implies, realize that it's there, and make the best of that!
(In one word boundless; no beginning no end. That's the one thing that's for sure. The rest is up to what science (assumedly) figures out)

4.What does the future offer? It doesn't offer timetravel. Time's only a measurement of movement. Past and future are figures of speech, the only thing that's here is the present and what it offers; answers and questions. To honour the good, you also have to be willing to learn from the bad. Don't feel bad about making mistakes, feel good about learning from them. Learn now, from history, for future reference. The future offers us a choice!
(existence is a boundless question consisting of an infinite amount of answers. You can't measure infinity, so subjecting it to measurements such as timspan is really our doing)

(Relationship; individuality, respect, togetherness)
5.Who are we? A human being is an intelligent, creative individual, and a work in progress from beginning to end. We have our limitations, but that's why we need each other; it's the force that binds us. All humans are part of mankind, but we're not all human. No one is worth more or less than anyone else, but we're not equal either. We are all unique parts of existence, with individual value!
(no two subjects can be perfectly similar, so there's the absolute of uniqueness)
6.Why are we here? Our common goal is not to belong or unite! You can't make unity; only break it. Form one group and there are two; inside and outside the circle. Us and them, is us against them waiting to happen. We are here to co-exist with all that exists. We are here to be together!
(dividing something by zero is bogus. Uniting infinity is equally pointless)

(Selfknowledge; especially check out the bit about primairy criteria. Anyone ever given this any thought?)
7.How do we think? Nothing does not-exist. Everything certainly (!), or possibly (?)exists, and answers to qualities that possibly or certainly apply; including our brain. It motivates (+)and restrains (-)us. Because !!! is the positive and ?? the negative*, our mind wants to have questions answered, and it doesn't like having it's answers questioned. The brain receives sensory INPUT, it handles the PROCESSING of neural activity, by interpreting questions and creating answers, there's the STORAGE of memories, and OUTPUT through emotion, expression, movement, and other activities of the body. But we're bi-o'-logical contemplators; not binary computers. Our brains natural urge can compell us to jump to conclusions. Not every answer is the correct solution, we can unintentionally fool ourselves and each other, so you have to take that into account. All negativity is caused by getting !!! and ?? mixed up. To be HONEST you have to distinguish between what's certain, and what isn't. We think in questions and answers, made from certainties and possibilities! (* !!!/?? can represent answer/question, fact/fiction, real/contemplative, concrete/abstract, knowledge/choice, conclusive/possible, etc.)
(Everything's certainly!! this and that, and possibly?? such and so. Neural trafic is electrochemical. Hook up the juice +!/-? et presto!)

8.How should we live? Live's about choices and knowledge to base those choices on, so choose wisely. Knowledge and choices based on certainties have positive impact. Getting possibility and certainty mixed up has negative impact. The good in life tells us what we're doing it for, the bad in life tells us why we're doing it. We should live our lives as honestly and wisely as possible! ...or else we jeapordize our existence.
(Even forcing a possibility into a certainty is contradicting infinity. Making a conclusive out of an inconclusive is one of many ways to foolishly slap a limit on boundlessness)

(Attitude; would you call these answers a sign of an attitudeproblem?)
9.What is love? In the absolute sense it's the opposite of hate. It's what we should try to approach ourselves, one another, and life in general with. Love is a positive, shameless, honest, binding, caring, selfless, attitude!
(everything has attributes, love included. Try using the opposites of these attributes as the definition of hate)

10. What is life? Life's a one time experience, and never what you expect from it, but ultimately what you make of it !
(see how this question ties in with the first one. The whole thing comes full circle. The elements of limitation and unpredictability can also be found in answ.1 and 4)

Well... here goes nothing. Edit post

[ August 29, 2002: Message edited by: Infinity Lover ]

[ August 29, 2002: Message edited by: Infinity Lover ]</p>

Clutch

Since every proposition implies itself, understanding what everything implies is at least as demanding as understanding everything simpliciter. However, it will not in this case be more demanding, since everything is, after all, everything.

More generally, what you've written above sounds like bafflegab. What does any of it have to do with infinity?

Infinity Lover

I agree that pointing out how the answers are based on infinity requires more elaborate explaination; though a lot of it is already in the answers formulation had you looked a bit more closely. The way it leads to possibility and certainty being the main catagory's (answ.7) for instance. The mind wants questions answered, and it isn't always as picky as it should be, because it never properly learned how. We are however capable of pottytraining ourselves, and not jump to conclusions.
Following up on the No7 answer I'd say the GOLDEN RULE OF COMMUNICATION is "in case of doubt always try to ask questions, before drawing conclusions. I assure you, I am willing and able to explain how these answers are infinity based, and you're more than welcome to either post or e-mail questions about that. As far as the nonsense factor goes... Answ8 "We are here to be together!" nonsense? I sincerely hope you don't really mean that?

Here's my explaination on what absolute infinity is. You can't stuff the whole of existence in your skull. But you can learn the definition of a word, and how the mechanics of a principle work...

THE PRINCIPLE OF ABSOLUTE INFINITY (p.a.i.)
This bit is boring perhaps, but it would be sloppy to leave it out. And if you don't feel like reading it... you don't have to know everything, but it helps if you know where you can look it up. P.a.i. is by no means some vague abstract notion in my mind; I understand it like I understand how to tie my shoelaces.

The absolutes of infinity
Absolutes are norms that always apply to a subject, regardless of which other subject you'd compare it with. Some absolutes actually apply to reality, others are purely contemplative. According to p.a.i. nothing and perfection are contemplative absolutes, limitation and uniqueness real absolutes, with infinity itself as the absolute norm that (only) applies to the whole of existence, and existence being the nature of infinity. Infinity exists, thus existence is infinite.

Nothing's perfect! not even infinity?
One subject out of many couldn't possibly be perfect, because it needs to be limited to offer room to other subjects. Lacking everything it doesn't contain, makes it 'imperfect'. The only thing that could be perfect, would be an infinite singularity, that doesn't offer room to anything besides itself. When they say nothing's perfect, they're right on the money. Nothing and perfection are one and the same. Nothing is the perfect lack of everything, and perfection the lack of nothing. Infinity also lacks nothing. Does that mean infinity is perfect? I'd beg to differ. Infinity doesn't offer room to perfection, and in that respect it has it's 'imperfections'; an infinite amount of them to be precise. The real absolute uniqueness, is another 'lack of perfection'; no two subjects can be perfectly similar, though an infinitely small difference is possible. Uniqueness being a real absolute, also means that (besides limitation and infinity) every other norm you could possibly come up with, is purely contemplative and theoretical. We can decide such a criterium certainly (!) does or doesn't apply, but we can also be in doubt (?) about that.
The certainties and possibilities of existence.
You can certainly look at existence as a boundless question, consisting of an infinite amount of limited answers. Existence, and every single thing in it (including our very brainactivity), can be translated into questionmarks and exclamationpoints.

Inward and outward infinity.
Try to picture a computeranimation of space, where you can infinitely scroll in every direction, but also infinitely zoom out and in... endlessly encountering smaller and smaller particles... that should give an idea of what our absolutely infinite existence looks like.
The zooming in, is what I call 'inward infinity', or towards certainty (!). In this case there is a contemplative limit you're headed towards; a mathmatical point. You know for certain the limit's there, but also that you'll never actually reach it; you'll just be getting infinitely closer and closer. A known example in physics is zero Kelvin. Again the lack of perfection plays a part. Particles can't stand perfectly still, so there will always be some kinetic energy, thus heat. The Greek philosopher Zeno's paradox, of being unable to reach a destination, because you'd first have to reach a point halfway, but first a point halfway halfway, etc. can easely be solved. Just let go of the foolish notion, that mathmatical perfection applies to reality. You simply pass the 'points' en-route by, to approximate your destination. That riddle pretty much brings out the perfectionist in you, and makes you regret it.
Outwards infinity would be the scrolling and zooming out. Towards possibility (?); infinitely into the uncertain, with no theoretical destination whatsoever. A mathmetical line infinitely going on in both directions, is outward infinity, and a piece of a line containing an infinite amount of points is a matter of inward infinity.

M.A.R.

[ August 22, 2002: Message edited by: Absolute Infinity ]

[ August 22, 2002: Message edited by: Absolute Infinity ]

[ August 22, 2002: Message edited by: Absolute Infinity ]</p>

sweep

absolute infinity:

It is quite simple to me- no-thing (meaning) everything has to change. A permanent human is like a plastic wrapper in a bush- it doesn't go away. we need and end and a beginning and another end, and our language is inadequate to explain it.

I agree

i agree, but infinity isn't something i am going to bust my nut on, if you know what i mean!

i feel hope in those words. yes

our individual worth depends on the output- if you bash your childs head in with a brick then you are worthless, and so is your legacy!

At the moment my opinion is that i am here to laugh, to laugh at the absurdity of human belief and human action- we are all idiots. if i didn't laugh, i would go mad, instead- see the difference? &lt; &gt;

i would have to say that it is mostly guesswork but you do raise some interesting points on the duality of the mind. OUr minds are built upon our language, and it drives me mad as i can't see past my own present- aaagh! i think it is important to learn to read relavance in the now- if you get stoned a lot then the telly might say stuff to you- self- relavant stuff, and its quite funny- i'm no schizo (that's only stigmata). No wonder buddha is smiling- it has the mind of a child, and doesn't lie to itself!

nice attitude

i agree. Evil takes, evil eats, until all life is extinguished. And then it becomes hungry and devours itself. then good grows again.

i agree but don't think much about 'one time'

Infinity Lover

...okay, this is perhaps a bit of a lame way to save this thread from premature obscurity. I'm only doing this once. Promised.

Amie

Marcel,
I think your ideas are just groovy what is life? you got it love!
Amie~

Amie

I like your philosophy but in a recent discussion with you I am confused about something and I was hoping you would clear it up....

Now you state that you do not like conclusions to be drawn in some aspects of ones life, but it just seems to me that looking at believers and saying statements of "I don't ever want to be like THEM" has a conclusion there. I am not intending to be antagonistic with you Marcel, I am just wanting some clarity here. I am sure if I pointed to a group of nonbelievers and stated "I don't ever want to be like THEM" you would ask the same and I would expect you too...

I do love you, but I am not sure why the generalizations and stereotypes that you seem so against came into play here <img src="confused.gif" border="0">

Infinity Lover

If I recall, I was referring to churchfollowers, engaging in religious rituals, singing songs of worship in unity. As much the word "them" may have generalisation written all over it, the people attending mass undeniably participate in these activities, and there is an element of uniformity involved, so I don't think it's an unconstituded generalisation, based on prejudice, in that respect. But "I wouldn't want to do the same thing" would've been a better choice of words, I'll admit.

Even if I believed in a god (or at least what you'd consider god to be), I still wouldn't adept a frame of mind where one would be considered a 'higher power', making me the lower whatever. I guess that's why worship creeps me out.
Add the element of uniformity, merrily singing along with the rest how I'd want to give my life to that god, and how he's my lord an sheppard, and we are very much talking about the sort of thing, I'd never be inclined to do.

[qb]I am sure if I pointed to a group of nonbelievers and stated "I don't ever want to be like THEM" you would ask the same and I would expect you too...</strong>
Or you could be saying "men all suck". I'll admit I would hope you at least wouldn't think I suck too.

<strong>I do love you, </strong>
I love you too.

<strong>but I am not sure why the generalizations and stereotypes that you seem so against came into play here </strong>
we all get confronted with those from time to time, and we should surely be carefull about how we wave them around. But I do think it would be naieve to assume they're all based on thin air and nothing else. Some people do end up adapting stereotypes, related to the 'group' they belong to.

Amie

so? whats wrong with singing songs in church? why do you attach a negative stigma to that?

what about the singing of the national anthem? they sing in unity. Or is your distaste confined to religious songs?
No one said you had to be inclined to do anything...

okie dokie
[edit cuz once again I screwed up the quote boxes]

[ November 14, 2002: Message edited by: Amie ]</p>

Infinity Lover

Edited because of double post.

[ November 14, 2002: Message edited by: Infinity Lover ]</p>