Freethought & Rationalism Archive

DarkBronzePlant · 07-08-2002, 02:46 PM

If I was convinced that god and the bible were true, then heck yeah, I'd do what he said and worship him. Of course, I wouldn't be entirely convinced or assured that I'd be going to heaven anyway... my mind would probably always wander to the ideas of the gnostics, who claimed that god was really just some bumblefuck who liked to think himself all-powerful, and who had a gigantic ego, but really just screws up everything. In which case, I'd really question his ability to create a wonderful heaven, or ensure that I get there in the first place.

One of the last sane · 07-08-2002, 02:51 PM

Heading to Hell, why do you only count Jews as people?

What about the other 5 million or more who went into the gas chambers but weren't Jews? The gypsies, Slavs, Magyars, homosexuals etc etc? They don't count as people to you?

Me, I count people as people whether they are Jewish or not.

OneMoreDave · 07-08-2002, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Heading to Hell:
<strong>I couldn't worship anything that let Hitler kill 6 million people.</strong>

I've heard this sort of comment a number of times, and I don't think it makes sense. IF Xianity is real, then this life is a tiny speck compared to the eternal life to follow. The significance of it, of course, is that it determines where you spend that eternity.

But that significance is not a function of length of mortal life. Framed in this full context, letting Hitler kill 6 million people is just not a big deal. Their being killed does not effect whether they go to heaven or hell, and so does not matter.

This is sort of like saying, "I couldn't worship anything that let 6 million people stub their toes in the morning."

Just a thought.

Dave

philechat · 07-08-2002, 03:11 PM

Gotta love Hell. Most great men in history are not fundies as far as I see. Music rocks down here, angst poetry and abstract art got created daily. Philosophers continue to debate about the meaning of existence and suffering (in hell).

They are better men and women than those overweight hairy-assed white politicians who spend an eternity in heaven singing lame hymns in praise of Yahweh.

[ July 08, 2002: Message edited by: philechat ]</p>

hal9000 · 07-08-2002, 03:59 PM

What if <a href="http://www.secweb.org/asset.asp?AssetID=105" target="_blank">this</a> and <a href="http://www.secweb.org/asset.asp?AssetID=208" target="_blank">this</a> were true? Ah, The god-devil thing so much fun!

Keith Russell · 07-10-2002, 02:31 PM

Greetings:

If God could be shown to exist just as the Bible said, He would be the most ardent enemy humanity has ever had.

Anyone who would worhsip such a being is a traitor to their own kind.

No way I could be that.

Keith.

Heading to Hell · 07-10-2002, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Heading to Hell, why do you only count Jews as people?
What about the other 5 million or more who went into the gas chambers but weren't Jews? The gypsies, Slavs, Magyars, homosexuals etc etc? They don't count as people to you?

Me, I count people as people whether they are Jewish or not.

Damn and blast and curses! Sorry - got my figures wrong. No slight intended, or even imagined. Thanks for pointing it out.

Quote:

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Heading to Hell:
I couldn't worship anything that let Hitler kill 6 million people.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I've heard this sort of comment a number of times, and I don't think it makes sense. IF Xianity is real, then this life is a tiny speck compared to the eternal life to follow. The significance of it, of course, is that it determines where you spend that eternity.

But that significance is not a function of length of mortal life. Framed in this full context, letting Hitler kill 6 million people is just not a big deal. Their being killed does not effect whether they go to heaven or hell, and so does not matter.

This is sort of like saying, "I couldn't worship anything that let 6 million people stub their toes in the morning."

Just a thought.

Dave

Er.. Dave... do you have any idea what they went through? Stubbing your toe is hardly a comparison. And by your logic we might as well kill everybody in the world - after all, they are already going to heaven or hell, aren't they? What does it matter?
Grr.
HtH

Answerer · 07-10-2002, 05:28 PM

Guys, it is clear from the bible, God do change his mind, so what if one day, he suddenly changes his mind and break the promises that made to his 'faithful', does this mean war between God and us humans?

John Page · 07-10-2002, 06:09 PM

I'd study god a lot and then steal its intellectual property and start up my own shop, "Church of Freedom, home of the God of Entropy".

I'd probably have someone ghost write a lot of self-help books too, you know, things like "God for Dummies", "Installing God under Windows XP" and "More of God's Greatest Mistakes".

Cheers, John

Koyaanisqatsi · 07-11-2002, 05:22 AM

I would hold a criminal tribunal and judge Yahweh guilty of mass murder and heinous crimes against humanity on the spot, of course, and force "him" to carry out justice and execute himself.

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07-08-2002, 02:46 PM	#11
DarkBronzePlant Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: San Francisco, CA USA Posts: 3,568	If I was convinced that god and the bible were true, then heck yeah, I'd do what he said and worship him. Of course, I wouldn't be entirely convinced or assured that I'd be going to heaven anyway... my mind would probably always wander to the ideas of the gnostics, who claimed that god was really just some bumblefuck who liked to think himself all-powerful, and who had a gigantic ego, but really just screws up everything. In which case, I'd really question his ability to create a wonderful heaven, or ensure that I get there in the first place.

07-08-2002, 02:51 PM	#12
One of the last sane Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: hereabouts Posts: 734	Heading to Hell, why do you only count Jews as people? What about the other 5 million or more who went into the gas chambers but weren't Jews? The gypsies, Slavs, Magyars, homosexuals etc etc? They don't count as people to you? Me, I count people as people whether they are Jewish or not.

07-08-2002, 03:11 PM	#14
philechat Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Mind of the Other Posts: 886	Gotta love Hell. Most great men in history are not fundies as far as I see. Music rocks down here, angst poetry and abstract art got created daily. Philosophers continue to debate about the meaning of existence and suffering (in hell). They are better men and women than those overweight hairy-assed white politicians who spend an eternity in heaven singing lame hymns in praise of Yahweh. [ July 08, 2002: Message edited by: philechat ]</p>

07-08-2002, 03:59 PM	#15
hal9000 Regular Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: just over your shoulder Posts: 146	What if <a href="http://www.secweb.org/asset.asp?AssetID=105" target="_blank">this</a> and <a href="http://www.secweb.org/asset.asp?AssetID=208" target="_blank">this</a> were true? Ah, The god-devil thing so much fun!

07-10-2002, 02:31 PM	#16
Keith Russell Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Overland Park, Kansas Posts: 1,336	Greetings: If God could be shown to exist just as the Bible said, He would be the most ardent enemy humanity has ever had. Anyone who would worhsip such a being is a traitor to their own kind. No way I could be that. Keith.

07-10-2002, 05:28 PM	#18
Answerer Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Singapore Posts: 3,956	Guys, it is clear from the bible, God do change his mind, so what if one day, he suddenly changes his mind and break the promises that made to his 'faithful', does this mean war between God and us humans?

07-10-2002, 06:09 PM	#19
John Page Veteran Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: US Posts: 5,495	I'd study god a lot and then steal its intellectual property and start up my own shop, "Church of Freedom, home of the God of Entropy". I'd probably have someone ghost write a lot of self-help books too, you know, things like "God for Dummies", "Installing God under Windows XP" and "More of God's Greatest Mistakes". Cheers, John

07-11-2002, 05:22 AM	#20
Koyaanisqatsi Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Yes, I have dyslexia. Sue me. Posts: 6,508	I would hold a criminal tribunal and judge Yahweh guilty of mass murder and heinous crimes against humanity on the spot, of course, and force "him" to carry out justice and execute himself.

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