Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Reactor · 01-21-2002, 06:08 PM

What's so wrong about having a Christian on this forum who stands by what he believes? I've posted on a few threads, and all I've run into is a bunch of mouse-trap like anti-Christianity zealots, who are just waiting to snap down upon any and every person with an opinion slightly different from their own. It's like a giant cut and post fest every time I say or ask something. Rimstalker, you even cut up and tried to pick on a joke I cracked. Anyone else on the face of the planet would have just chuckled at it, but you just rambled something off about about the list of logical fallacies.

I guess it really frustrates you guys when someone arrives on this forum and just won't budge from his convictions. But you see, what you guys don't know is what a person like me does when he isn't writing on a forum like this. He writes down points. He considers things. He may even be considering ditching the bible tomorrow.

But hey, why worry about that, eh? Just cut up his posts! Call him a stubborn bastard! Kick that Christian's ass before he says anything else stupid and unwise! Look at him- he only has 10 or so posts. How can he compare with the regular guys who have over a 1000? If he isn't going to be open and accept our opinion as the only one, then abuse his butt from off this forum!

I was checking out some of the other forums yesterday, and most of them have posts like "Where have all the Christians gone?" Well, where the heck do you think they've gone? They've gone to do something worth while! Posting on a forum like this is like asking a gang of thungs to abuse you day and night for a week. There's zero compassion here, unless you agree with the (obviously) 'open minded' opinion that only you guys can be right.

Who's ready and anxious right now to cut up this post and start picking on every word I've said? That's it, raise those hands up high. Bless you all. Well, I'd better make a quick departure from this scene, though I may stick around for a while, just to annoy the heck out of you guys by sticking to my standard (immovable) beliefs.

But just before I do... damn Rimstalker, I have never in my entire life seen a guy who can take an entire almost slapstick like humor thread (though obviously you didn't find it funny), rip it apart, and wind up with as much trifle about who I am and what I believe than what you did. Well done. I don't know how you did it, but... well done.

Also, try this logic Rimstalker. The bible says Jesus is the son of God. You say he's a mythic hero. I say prove it, because you're contradicting the bible who had any opinion about Jesus, first. You need to prove it to me- not the other way around. But that aside, I didn't ask for proof anyway. I asked for something a little more solid. You can't even give me that, can you? If you suddenly can, reply to this post (cut and quote free) and give it to me, so I can study it. Pretty please with a cherry on top, thankyou.

Polycarp · 01-21-2002, 06:57 PM

Reactor,

Speaking as a Christian who has posted here sporadically for a couple years, I'll be the first to tell you that the exchanges you've witnessed are par for the course. Nobody is singling you out for mistreatment. This is a place of equal opportunity insults. People on both sides of the fence (Christian and non) are often guilty of impersonating an idiot. There's something about discussing an issue over the internet that leads people to say things they'd never say in a face-to-face conversation. Long ago I realized I had two choices in this area: lighten up and grow thicker skin OR get outta Dodge...

And I only have 290 posts to my name

Reactor · 01-21-2002, 09:31 PM

I appreciate your thoughts, Polycarp. You're right that the Christian community on here is also guilty of the same thing, though I've seen a great deal more of it on the non-Christian side. I'm guessing the reason internet discussion can lead to difficult conversations (compared to those face-to-face) is that there's a lot more room for misunderstanding. I think I'm learning that not everyone on here can pick up on sarcasm, irony, or a joke. There's a complete overabundance of writing on here, and I guess that only serves to compound the problem. People are too quick to cut and quote, and more inclined to skim over what someone has written, than ponder on it.

It's always easy to grow bitter in a place where the most loved thing is your opinion. You're right- it's time to let things sway

Toto · 01-21-2002, 09:48 PM

Hi Reactor, I haven't run into you much yet. The purpose of these boards is not to have an on-line tea party, it is to debate and discuss controversial issues. You have to get used to having what you say criticized and ripped apart. It's all part of the game, and builds character and puts hair on your chest.

If you just got here, you have missed some of our more hostile Christians, but you can read Metacrock to see the sort of person you share a religion with.

I just looked at some of your recent posts. You started a thread on the Ezra Nehemiah difficulties that was well received. Several well known atheists welcomed you and made friendly comments. I wonder if you are being a bit hypersensitive?

I don't know which joke Rimstalker picked apart, but if it was the one on the mythical hero thread you should be aware that most jokes have some underlying hostility to them, as I think yours did. In polite conversation you can hide this with a smile, but on the internet the hostility shines through, and invites a similarly hostile response.

Reactor · 01-21-2002, 11:00 PM

I think initially I was quite relaxed about posting on this board, but after a while I did become a little hypersensitive, yes

I'm a regular poster on a computergame forum (when I'm not on here) and it's common practice there to push people hard with extreme levels of sarcasm. I'm a constant joker, and there's nothing more enjoyable to me than throwing a little humour into the cooking pot of serious stew. I'll try to refrain from doing that, from now on. Instead, I'm going to think very carefully about what I post and keep things... well... professional

cricket · 01-21-2002, 11:03 PM

Quote:

It's all part of the game, and builds character and puts hair on your chest.

That's all I need is more hair on my chest.

Damn.

Reactor · 01-21-2002, 11:26 PM

Oh my goodness! A joke!

*does a little dance*

A non-religious one too. Extra points for that must be in order

Jayhawker Soule · 01-22-2002, 05:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Reactor:
<strong>
Also, try this logic Rimstalker. The bible says Jesus is the son of God. You say he's a mythic hero. I say prove it, because you're contradicting the bible who had any opinion about Jesus, first. You need to prove it to me- not the other way around.</strong>

Sorry, but this seems a remarkably peculiar and silly criteria for assigning burden of proof.

The following is taken from Hesiod's Theogony (circa 8th century BCE):

Quote:

(ll. 116-138) Verily at the first Chaos came to be, but next wide-bosomed Earth, the ever-sure foundations of all (4) the deathless ones who hold the peaks of snowy Olympus, and dim Tartarus in the depth of the wide-pathed Earth, and Eros (Love), fairest among the deathless gods, who unnerves the limbs and overcomes the mind and wise counsels of all gods and all men
within them. From Chaos came forth Erebus and black Night; but of Night were born Aether (5) and Day, whom she conceived and bare from union in love with Erebus. And Earth first bare starry
Heaven, equal to herself, to cover her on every side, and to be an ever-sure abiding-place for the blessed gods. And she brought forth long Hills, graceful haunts of the goddess-Nymphs who dwell amongst the glens of the hills. She bare also the fruitless deep with his raging swell, Pontus, without sweet union of love. But
afterwards she lay with Heaven and bare deep-swirling Oceanus, Coeus and Crius and Hyperion and Iapetus, Theia and Rhea, Themis and Mnemosyne and gold-crowned Phoebe and lovely Tethys. After
them was born Cronos the wily, youngest and most terrible of her children, and he hated his lusty sire. ...

(ll. 211-225) And Night bare hateful Doom and black Fate and Death, and she bare Sleep and the tribe of Dreams. And again the goddess murky Night, though she lay with none, bare Blame and painful Woe, and the Hesperides who guard the rich, golden apples and the trees bearing fruit beyond glorious Ocean. Also she bare the Destinies and ruthless avenging Fates, Clotho and Lachesis and Atropos (10), who give men at their birth both evil and good to have, and they pursue the transgressions of men and of gods: and these goddesses never cease from their dread anger until they punish the sinner with a sore penalty. Also deadly Night bare Nemesis (Indignation) to afflict mortal men, and after her, Deceit and Friendship and hateful Age and hard-hearted Strife.

It's a rather beautiful story, replete with virgin birth. So, do you accept the myth or the burden of proof?

See for example: <a href="http://sunsite.berkeley.edu/OMACL/Hesiod/theogony.html" target="_blank">Hesiod's Theogony</a>

Reactor · 01-22-2002, 06:06 AM

I like it, and it does add to the case, but I certainly wouldn't slap it with the term 'proof'.

Jayhawker Soule · 01-22-2002, 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Reactor:
<strong>I like it, and it does add to the case, but I certainly wouldn't slap it with the term 'proof'.</strong>

Huh? <img src="confused.gif" border="0">

01-21-2002, 06:08 PM	#1
Reactor Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Perth, Australia Posts: 43	Rimstalker (and anyone else who cares)... What's so wrong about having a Christian on this forum who stands by what he believes? I've posted on a few threads, and all I've run into is a bunch of mouse-trap like anti-Christianity zealots, who are just waiting to snap down upon any and every person with an opinion slightly different from their own. It's like a giant cut and post fest every time I say or ask something. Rimstalker, you even cut up and tried to pick on a joke I cracked. Anyone else on the face of the planet would have just chuckled at it, but you just rambled something off about about the list of logical fallacies. I guess it really frustrates you guys when someone arrives on this forum and just won't budge from his convictions. But you see, what you guys don't know is what a person like me does when he isn't writing on a forum like this. He writes down points. He considers things. He may even be considering ditching the bible tomorrow. But hey, why worry about that, eh? Just cut up his posts! Call him a stubborn bastard! Kick that Christian's ass before he says anything else stupid and unwise! Look at him- he only has 10 or so posts. How can he compare with the regular guys who have over a 1000? If he isn't going to be open and accept our opinion as the only one, then abuse his butt from off this forum! I was checking out some of the other forums yesterday, and most of them have posts like "Where have all the Christians gone?" Well, where the heck do you think they've gone? They've gone to do something worth while! Posting on a forum like this is like asking a gang of thungs to abuse you day and night for a week. There's zero compassion here, unless you agree with the (obviously) 'open minded' opinion that only you guys can be right. Who's ready and anxious right now to cut up this post and start picking on every word I've said? That's it, raise those hands up high. Bless you all. Well, I'd better make a quick departure from this scene, though I may stick around for a while, just to annoy the heck out of you guys by sticking to my standard (immovable) beliefs. But just before I do... damn Rimstalker, I have never in my entire life seen a guy who can take an entire almost slapstick like humor thread (though obviously you didn't find it funny), rip it apart, and wind up with as much trifle about who I am and what I believe than what you did. Well done. I don't know how you did it, but... well done. Also, try this logic Rimstalker. The bible says Jesus is the son of God. You say he's a mythic hero. I say prove it, because you're contradicting the bible who had any opinion about Jesus, first. You need to prove it to me- not the other way around. But that aside, I didn't ask for proof anyway. I asked for something a little more solid. You can't even give me that, can you? If you suddenly can, reply to this post (cut and quote free) and give it to me, so I can study it. Pretty please with a cherry on top, thankyou.

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01-21-2002, 06:57 PM	#2
Polycarp Regular Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: USA Posts: 228	Reactor, Speaking as a Christian who has posted here sporadically for a couple years, I'll be the first to tell you that the exchanges you've witnessed are par for the course. Nobody is singling you out for mistreatment. This is a place of equal opportunity insults. People on both sides of the fence (Christian and non) are often guilty of impersonating an idiot. There's something about discussing an issue over the internet that leads people to say things they'd never say in a face-to-face conversation. Long ago I realized I had two choices in this area: lighten up and grow thicker skin OR get outta Dodge... And I only have 290 posts to my name

01-21-2002, 09:31 PM	#3
Reactor Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Perth, Australia Posts: 43	I appreciate your thoughts, Polycarp. You're right that the Christian community on here is also guilty of the same thing, though I've seen a great deal more of it on the non-Christian side. I'm guessing the reason internet discussion can lead to difficult conversations (compared to those face-to-face) is that there's a lot more room for misunderstanding. I think I'm learning that not everyone on here can pick up on sarcasm, irony, or a joke. There's a complete overabundance of writing on here, and I guess that only serves to compound the problem. People are too quick to cut and quote, and more inclined to skim over what someone has written, than ponder on it. It's always easy to grow bitter in a place where the most loved thing is your opinion. You're right- it's time to let things sway

01-21-2002, 09:48 PM	#4
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	Hi Reactor, I haven't run into you much yet. The purpose of these boards is not to have an on-line tea party, it is to debate and discuss controversial issues. You have to get used to having what you say criticized and ripped apart. It's all part of the game, and builds character and puts hair on your chest. If you just got here, you have missed some of our more hostile Christians, but you can read Metacrock to see the sort of person you share a religion with. I just looked at some of your recent posts. You started a thread on the Ezra Nehemiah difficulties that was well received. Several well known atheists welcomed you and made friendly comments. I wonder if you are being a bit hypersensitive? I don't know which joke Rimstalker picked apart, but if it was the one on the mythical hero thread you should be aware that most jokes have some underlying hostility to them, as I think yours did. In polite conversation you can hide this with a smile, but on the internet the hostility shines through, and invites a similarly hostile response.

01-21-2002, 11:00 PM	#5
Reactor Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Perth, Australia Posts: 43	I think initially I was quite relaxed about posting on this board, but after a while I did become a little hypersensitive, yes I'm a regular poster on a computergame forum (when I'm not on here) and it's common practice there to push people hard with extreme levels of sarcasm. I'm a constant joker, and there's nothing more enjoyable to me than throwing a little humour into the cooking pot of serious stew. I'll try to refrain from doing that, from now on. Instead, I'm going to think very carefully about what I post and keep things... well... professional

01-21-2002, 11:26 PM	#7
Reactor Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Perth, Australia Posts: 43	Oh my goodness! A joke! does a little dance A non-religious one too. Extra points for that must be in order

01-22-2002, 06:06 AM	#9
Reactor Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Perth, Australia Posts: 43	I like it, and it does add to the case, but I certainly wouldn't slap it with the term 'proof'.

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