Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Bumble Bee Tuna · 12-13-2002, 11:34 AM

I know we're not allowed to advocate criminal activities here, and that is not my intent. But I'm curious. Have any atheists ever, when confronted with some unconstitutional religious thing, simply removed it of their own volition? I know this isn't quite possible when it's a huge granite monument, but surely there are times when it's possible.
I ask because when my school had "god bless america" posters up on the wall, instead of going through the trouble of filing complaints, I just took the things down and threw them out. I just wish it was that easy with major things...alas, we have to use the courts.

-B

Toto · 12-13-2002, 12:02 PM

It's one thing if the posters are there in violation of the school's rules, but another if they are official posters that you think are unconstitutional.

Some discussion on this old thread:

<a href="http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=2&t=000226&p=" target="_blank">Jesus sign on campus </a>

beejay · 12-13-2002, 12:18 PM

A number of people cross out "In God We Trust" on currency...does that count?

Two 10C monuments in Indiana have been vandalized.

In South Bend, it was spray painted with "not on public land", restored by volunteers and still remains. (Although the papers reported this as being done by "secular vandals", since they were never identified, you can't tell if they were secular or not.)

In Indianapolis the religious display was damaged beyond repair. A new monument was constructed, the state was taken to court and the state lost. I think the monument is now on private property somewhere.

I understand the impulse to "just tear it down". I would start, however, with an appeal to the appropriate authorities. If that fails, it is much better for the cause of liberty (and better for the reputation of atheists) to pursue the matter in the courts.

Tearing down one poster takes care of one poster. Getting a court decision that the poster is unconstitutional takes care of a lot of posters in a lot of places.

LLaurieG · 12-13-2002, 01:30 PM

(Laurie) Nope, I've never done it. But everytime I see a Jesus fish or a strident collection of born-again bumperstickers on a car, there's that strong temptation to remove a tiny little squirt gun from my purse filled with something nasty to car paint jobs and have at it. Haven't done it though. Nosirree bob. In fact, I am shocked, shocked! that anyone would contemplate such a cathartic and destructive anti-religious act. Especially in any parking lots where there might be security cameras.

Bumble Bee Tuna · 12-13-2002, 01:57 PM

hmmm...

Reading that thread, I can't help but wonder why the apporach wasn't taken of just removing the sign. No need for secrecy or anything. Just take a ladder there and remove the sign. The school said it was against policy, so if the school doesn't take it down, you have the right to take it down (removing litter), right? Well, there's the challenge of getting a ladder and whatnot but it seems like that would work fine.

BTW reading that thread made me think- what if Hispanic people played hockey? Maybe you'd get a goalie named Jesus. "He shoots! Jesus saves!" that would never get old.

And Laurie, you carry a squirt gun filled with a corrosive liquid around in your purse? Haven't you ever heard of MACE?

Oy, but I'm getting off topic in my own thread...

-B

GaryP · 12-13-2002, 02:38 PM

My city has a Nativity Scene on public property.

I am tempted to go down there and tape a "non-tract" from the Freedom From Religion Foundation right on baby Jesus' nose!

Marruk · 12-13-2002, 02:54 PM

I always go out of my way to change the message on the bible thumper posters at school. Usually it just takes a sharpie and changing a few characters. I love doing it, because for weeks a bunch of fundie signs might say I sleep with atheists before the fundies see them and take them down.

LLaurieG · 12-14-2002, 09:19 AM

Quote:

BBTuna: And Laurie, you carry a squirt gun filled with a corrosive liquid around in your purse? Haven't you ever heard of MACE?

(Laurie) No! I DON'T carry around a squirt gun filled with bleach, lye, oven cleaner, paint stripper or Drano! Moi? One of those immoral heathen "doing their best to piss off the religious right?" Perish the thought! And, irritating as Jesus fish are, I haven't had to Mace one late at night out in a parking lot yet.

[ December 14, 2002: Message edited by: LLaurieG ]</p>

Shake · 12-15-2002, 07:06 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by LLaurieG:
<strong>(Laurie) Nope, I've never done it. But everytime I see a Jesus fish or a strident collection of born-again bumperstickers on a car, there's that strong temptation to remove a tiny little squirt gun from my purse filled with something nasty to car paint jobs and have at it. Haven't done it though. Nosirree bob. In fact, I am shocked, shocked! that anyone would contemplate such a cathartic and destructive anti-religious act. Especially in any parking lots where there might be security cameras.</strong>

I had a co-worker once who was making what looked like little 'L's out of flat magnetic strips. I asked him what he was doing with them, and he said he used them to make feet for the Jebus fishes!

Godless Dave · 12-18-2002, 10:55 AM

The target wasn't strictly religious, and I don't know whether or not the perpetrators were atheists, but when I was in college there was a pro-life billboard a block from campus that said "I had fingerprints 19 days after conception". Someone used a can of spraypaint to add "and gills and a tail".

Several years after graduation I was hanging out with some women I knew from college and I mentioned remembering that billboard and the graffiti. Two of them got a very knowing look on their faces.

12-13-2002, 11:34 AM	#1
Bumble Bee Tuna Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Middletown, CT Posts: 7,333	Any cases of atheist vandalism? I know we're not allowed to advocate criminal activities here, and that is not my intent. But I'm curious. Have any atheists ever, when confronted with some unconstitutional religious thing, simply removed it of their own volition? I know this isn't quite possible when it's a huge granite monument, but surely there are times when it's possible. I ask because when my school had "god bless america" posters up on the wall, instead of going through the trouble of filing complaints, I just took the things down and threw them out. I just wish it was that easy with major things...alas, we have to use the courts. -B

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12-13-2002, 12:02 PM	#2
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	It's one thing if the posters are there in violation of the school's rules, but another if they are official posters that you think are unconstitutional. Some discussion on this old thread: <a href="http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=2&t=000226&p=" target="_blank">Jesus sign on campus </a>

12-13-2002, 12:18 PM	#3
beejay Regular Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Richmond IN Posts: 375	A number of people cross out "In God We Trust" on currency...does that count? Two 10C monuments in Indiana have been vandalized. In South Bend, it was spray painted with "not on public land", restored by volunteers and still remains. (Although the papers reported this as being done by "secular vandals", since they were never identified, you can't tell if they were secular or not.) In Indianapolis the religious display was damaged beyond repair. A new monument was constructed, the state was taken to court and the state lost. I think the monument is now on private property somewhere. I understand the impulse to "just tear it down". I would start, however, with an appeal to the appropriate authorities. If that fails, it is much better for the cause of liberty (and better for the reputation of atheists) to pursue the matter in the courts. Tearing down one poster takes care of one poster. Getting a court decision that the poster is unconstitutional takes care of a lot of posters in a lot of places.

12-13-2002, 01:30 PM	#4
LLaurieG Regular Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: So. California Posts: 116	(Laurie) Nope, I've never done it. But everytime I see a Jesus fish or a strident collection of born-again bumperstickers on a car, there's that strong temptation to remove a tiny little squirt gun from my purse filled with something nasty to car paint jobs and have at it. Haven't done it though. Nosirree bob. In fact, I am shocked, shocked! that anyone would contemplate such a cathartic and destructive anti-religious act. Especially in any parking lots where there might be security cameras.

12-13-2002, 01:57 PM	#5
Bumble Bee Tuna Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Middletown, CT Posts: 7,333	hmmm... Reading that thread, I can't help but wonder why the apporach wasn't taken of just removing the sign. No need for secrecy or anything. Just take a ladder there and remove the sign. The school said it was against policy, so if the school doesn't take it down, you have the right to take it down (removing litter), right? Well, there's the challenge of getting a ladder and whatnot but it seems like that would work fine. BTW reading that thread made me think- what if Hispanic people played hockey? Maybe you'd get a goalie named Jesus. "He shoots! Jesus saves!" that would never get old. And Laurie, you carry a squirt gun filled with a corrosive liquid around in your purse? Haven't you ever heard of MACE? Oy, but I'm getting off topic in my own thread... -B

12-13-2002, 02:38 PM	#6
GaryP Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Lancaster, OH Posts: 1,792	My city has a Nativity Scene on public property. I am tempted to go down there and tape a "non-tract" from the Freedom From Religion Foundation right on baby Jesus' nose!

12-13-2002, 02:54 PM	#7
Marruk Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Long Beach, CA Posts: 1,596	I always go out of my way to change the message on the bible thumper posters at school. Usually it just takes a sharpie and changing a few characters. I love doing it, because for weeks a bunch of fundie signs might say I sleep with atheists before the fundies see them and take them down.

12-18-2002, 10:55 AM	#10
Godless Dave Contributor Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: With 10,000 lakes who needs a coast? Posts: 10,762	The target wasn't strictly religious, and I don't know whether or not the perpetrators were atheists, but when I was in college there was a pro-life billboard a block from campus that said "I had fingerprints 19 days after conception". Someone used a can of spraypaint to add "and gills and a tail". Several years after graduation I was hanging out with some women I knew from college and I mentioned remembering that billboard and the graffiti. Two of them got a very knowing look on their faces.

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