Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Automaton · 11-30-2002, 07:34 PM

These scientists say that there was a Big Bang. Well a bang is a loud noise. But sound cannot travel in empty space, and space was supposedly empty outside of the dot that the Big Bang came from. So it would have been impossible for it to "bang". I have disproved Evolution!

Novowels · 11-30-2002, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jesus Christ:
 It just takes an assload of pressure to compress liquids.

1 assload? What's that in metric?

Grumpy · 12-01-2002, 10:31 AM

I'm confused. I thought "assload" was a unit of volume, not Force / Area.

[ December 01, 2002: Message edited by: Grumpy ]

tgamble · 12-01-2002, 03:21 PM

Here's a site that allegedly proves the bible predicted atomic bombs.

<a href="http://www.childrenofyahweh.com/Comparet/hydrogen_bomb.htm" target="_blank">http://www.childrenofyahweh.com/Comparet/hydrogen_bomb.htm</a> <img src="graemlins/boohoo.gif" border="0" alt="[Boo Hoo]" /> <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

The page quotes II Esdras 15:44. According to biblegateway.com, no such book exists. Anyone here know why?

"The Wisdom of Solomon 5:21..." I checked and Solomon 5 only goes up to verse 16! Are they really this stupid or am I missing something?!

Let us all now have a good laugh at the "wisdom" that includes stars falling, the sun turning into darkness and the moon into blood. HAHA!

[ December 01, 2002: Message edited by: tgamble ]

12-01-2002, 04:03 PM

Greetings tgamble,

2 Esdras is sometimes called 4 Ezra or even 2 Ezra, here is the relevant passage, with context :

Quote:

[33] And from the land of the Assyrians an enemy in ambush shall beset them and destroy one of them, and fear and trembling shall come upon their army, and indecision upon their kings.
[34] Behold, clouds from the east, and from the north to the south; and their appearance is very threatening, full of wrath and storm.
[35] They shall dash against one another and shall pour out a heavy tempest upon the earth, and their own tempest; and there shall be blood from the sword as high as a horse's belly
[36] and a man's thigh and a camel's hock.
[37] And there shall be fear and great trembling upon the earth; and those who see that wrath shall be horror-stricken, and they shall be seized with trembling.
[38] And, after that, heavy storm clouds shall be stirred up from the south, and from the north, and another part from the west.
[39] And the winds from the east shall prevail over the cloud that was raised in wrath, and shall dispel it; and the tempest that was to cause destruction by the east wind shall be driven violently toward the south and west.
[40] And great and mighty clouds, full of wrath and tempest, shall rise, to destroy all the earth and its inhabitants, and shall pour out upon every high and lofty place a terrible tempest,
[41] fire and hail and flying swords and floods of water, that all the fields and all the streams may be filled with the abundance of those waters.
[42] And they shall destroy cities and walls, mountains and hills, trees of the forests, and grass of the meadows, and their grain.
[43] And they shall go on steadily to Babylon, and shall destroy her.
[44] They shall come to her and surround her; they shall pour out the tempest and all its wrath upon her; then the dust and smoke shall go up to heaven, and all who are about her shall wail over her.
[45] And those who survive shall serve those who have destroyed her.
[46] And you, Asia, who share in the glamour of Babylon and the glory of her person --
[47] woe to you, miserable wretch! For you have made yourself like her; you have decked out your daughters in harlotry to please and glory in your lovers, who have always lusted after you.

Q.

[ December 01, 2002: Message edited by: Iasion ]

tgamble · 12-01-2002, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Iasion:
Greetings tgamble,

2 Esdras is sometimes called 4 Ezra or even 2 Ezra, here is the relevant passage, with context :
[ December 01, 2002: Message edited by: Iasion ]

Can you provide a link to an online bible? I still can't find it!

Celsus · 12-01-2002, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tgamble:
"The Wisdom of Solomon 5:21..." I checked and Solomon 5 only goes up to verse 16! Are they really this stupid or am I missing something?!

Let us all now have a good laugh at the "wisdom" that includes stars falling, the sun turning into darkness and the moon into blood. HAHA!

[ December 01, 2002: Message edited by: tgamble ]

Wisdom of Solomon is an apocryphal book, not to be confused with Proverbs, Songs of Solomon, or the Wisdom of Jesus (um... ben Sira(ch)) aka Ecclesiasticus (not to be confused with Ecclesiastes). All of them were written/compiled in the 3rd to 1st centuries BCE from Jewish "Wisdom" Schools that purportedly were started by Solomon (not likely). Wis. Solomon is definitely 1st century BCE, although the others are earlier.

Here's how my RSV of Wis.Solomon 5:21 reads:
19 he [God] will take the holiness as an invincible shield,
20 and sharpen stern wrath for a sword, and creation will join with him to fight against the madmen.
21 Shafts of lightning will fly with true aim, and will leap to the target as from a well-drawn bow of clouds.
22 and hailstones full of wrath will be hurled from a catapult; the water of the sea will rage against them, and rivers will relentlessly overwhelm them;
23 a mighty wind will rise against them, and like a tempest it will winnow them away. Lawlessness will lay waste the whole earth, and evil-doing will overturn the thrones of rulers.

Evidently, the author has seen lightning strike a tree or something tall.

Edited to show context of the verse.

Edited again to show off:

1 Esdras (Greek Bible) = 2 Esdras (Slavonic Bible) = 3 Esdras (Latin Vulgate) Add 1 to get second/fourth book of Esdras (Greek/Latin Vulgate). Ezra and Nehemiah are considered 1 & 2 Esdras in the Latin Vulgate, hence the confusion.

[ December 01, 2002: Message edited by: joejoejoe ]

[ December 01, 2002: Message edited by: joejoejoe ]

Jimmy Higgins · 12-02-2002, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by tgamble:
One of the links given was to Christiananswers.net where we find this:
5. Many strata are too tightly bent.
In many mountainous areas, strata thousands of feet thick are bent and folded into hairpin shapes. The conventional geologic time-scale says these formations were deeply buried and solidified for hundreds of millions of years before they were bent. Yet the folding occurred without cracking, with radii so small that the entire formation had to be still wet and unsolidified when the bending occurred. This implies that the folding occurred less than thousands of years after deposition.(13)

Also interested in #6. I think #7 is Gentry's work isn't it? Thanks!

Or that the rock was under intense pressure. I don't think any geologist thinks that the rock was capable of bending like that when solid. I do love the term radii, though.

12-02-2002, 01:38 PM

Greetings tgamble,

Try here :

<a href="http://wesley.nnu.edu/noncanon/apocrypha.htm" target="_blank">http://wesley.nnu.edu/noncanon/apocrypha.htm</a>

Note this book is apocryphal, not biblical.

Q.

BornOkTheFirstTime · 12-03-2002, 10:51 AM

For those of you who are not familiar with "Dr. Dino's" background, allow me to enlighten you:
Dr Hovind allegedly has a PhD from Patriot university. As much as he talks about QM, one might think that maybe this university teaches Physics, QM, and the like(if you ignore the fact that all his claims are patently false)

Actually, Patriot University is actually a school for "biblical studies"(which is currently located at a residential address), so he has no room to be talking about such things as QM and the like (obviously).

12-01-2002, 10:31 AM	#33
Grumpy Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Alaska, USA Posts: 1,535	I'm confused. I thought "assload" was a unit of volume, not Force / Area. [ December 01, 2002: Message edited by: Grumpy ]</p>

12-01-2002, 03:21 PM	#34
tgamble Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: St. John's, Nfld. Canada Posts: 1,652	Here's a site that allegedly proves the bible predicted atomic bombs. <a href="http://www.childrenofyahweh.com/Comparet/hydrogen_bomb.htm" target="_blank">http://www.childrenofyahweh.com/Comparet/hydrogen_bomb.htm</a> <img src="graemlins/boohoo.gif" border="0" alt="[Boo Hoo]" /> <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" /> The page quotes II Esdras 15:44. According to biblegateway.com, no such book exists. Anyone here know why? "The Wisdom of Solomon 5:21..." I checked and Solomon 5 only goes up to verse 16! Are they really this stupid or am I missing something?! Let us all now have a good laugh at the "wisdom" that includes stars falling, the sun turning into darkness and the moon into blood. HAHA! [ December 01, 2002: Message edited by: tgamble ]</p>

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11-30-2002, 07:34 PM	#31
Automaton Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 717	These scientists say that there was a Big Bang. Well a bang is a loud noise. But sound cannot travel in empty space, and space was supposedly empty outside of the dot that the Big Bang came from. So it would have been impossible for it to "bang". I have disproved Evolution!

12-02-2002, 01:38 PM	#39
Iasion Guest Posts: n/a	Greetings tgamble, Try here : <a href="http://wesley.nnu.edu/noncanon/apocrypha.htm" target="_blank">http://wesley.nnu.edu/noncanon/apocrypha.htm</a> Note this book is apocryphal, not biblical. Q.

12-03-2002, 10:51 AM	#40
BornOkTheFirstTime New Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 4	For those of you who are not familiar with "Dr. Dino's" background, allow me to enlighten you: Dr Hovind allegedly has a PhD from Patriot university. As much as he talks about QM, one might think that maybe this university teaches Physics, QM, and the like(if you ignore the fact that all his claims are patently false) Actually, Patriot University is actually a school for "biblical studies"(which is currently located at a residential address), so he has no room to be talking about such things as QM and the like (obviously).

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