Janaya

Why would God send me to hell if Jesus died for my sins?

This is a serious question for me and I would like a serious response.

Thanks,
Janaya

missus_gumby

(This topic may be moved to a more appropriate forum should serious replies be forthcoming.)

Martin - moderator

(PS Don't hold your breath. )

Queen of Swords

Maybe God has a hell-quota to fill. I remember reading that in the Holocaust, the camps had to dispose of so many people per day, to reach the correct numbers of so-many-thousands.

[ September 18, 2002: Message edited by: QueenofSwords ]</p>

Janaya

I'm sorry...I didn't know where else to put it.

I could not tell from the forum categories where believers might see it and respond. Maybe I just missed seeing it.

Janaya

missus_gumby

No need to apologise at all! We will let the thread stay here for the time being, but if there are serious replies, it can be moved to <a href="http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum&f=45" target="_blank">Misc Religious Discussions</a>.

I ate Pascal's Wafer

Well, this board is probably the wrong place to ask such a question. We have a couple Christians, but even with their answers you'll only have a couple points of view. Christian boards are probably better places to discuss this.

That said, here's my attempt at Christian explanations.

According to the Bible, everyone has sinned and has come short of the glory of God. Without the blood of the innocent, the sinful cannot be cleansed. (Hey, I didn't write the mythology.) If the sinful are not cleansed, they are unworthy of entrance into heaven. The only alternative is hell, which is where the unrepentent sinner can go.

Luckily, Jebus came along to die for our sins. He took the sins of all unto him, and even descended into hell for a few days. By doing that, Jebus made it possible for the sinner to be cleansed. However, the sinner must accept this gift. By giving your life to Jebus, you become "born again" and are cleansed of your sins. You are finally worthy to enter heaven.

If you turn away from Jebus and don't accept him into your heart you don't receive the gift of cleansed sins. It's your choice not to accept Jebus, and by choosing to ignore Jebus you are choosing not to accept his gift, and thus you are choosing hell.

&lt;takes bath in tub of acid&gt;

There are several problems with this line of thinking, and I'm sure you're bright enough to figure them out. However, that's a basic response that you might get from the average Christian.

-Nick

HelenM

That's basically the theological reason...

As the famous verse goes:

John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

Not everyone, but "whoever believes in Him".

The passage continues with this in verse 18:

"whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son."

According to the theology, not believing is perhaps somewhat like having someone set up a bank account in your name but you never withdraw from it so you never benefit from it.

So it's up to you whether to receive salvation or not - God doesn't 'force' you to be saved.

So far that's the freewill argument which is what many Christians would say.

Some other Christians see it a little differently but the point is that [according to the theology]only those who believe are saved.

Helen

GunnerJ

Could just as easily be rewritten, "For God so hated the world that he sacrificed himself to himself to apease his own anger at his own creation, so that whoever believes in him not shall not have eternal life but perish..."

An entirely false analogy. If told that someone set up such a bank account I could easily check and see if it was true and use it. I can do no such checking up on the claims of Christianity until, presumably, I am dead, at which point it is too late to withdraw. In fact, if you wanted to make your analogy prefect, it'd go something like this:

"Someone tells you that he set up a bank account for you with a million dollars. He tells you that you can only check the account and collect the money after you promise to be his slave for life, and if you don't sell yourself to slavery, he will burn you at the stake."

Even better is this analogy: <a href="http://jhuger.com/kisshank.mv" target="_blank">Kissing Hanks Ass</a>

Of course, being omniscient, he knows whether you will "chose" to believe or not anyway, thus severely limiting your possible "choices."

Janaya

I am still confused. If this is a 'gift' why is more required of me? I 'have to give my life to Jesus because he gave his life for me'...sounds like an exchange to me not a gift.

Again...(sorry)...I am still confused. Either Jesus died for me or he didn't. What difference does it make what I believe now?

If I accept Jesus...then he died for me.
If I reject Jesus...then he didn't die for me.
So my actions dictate what Jesus did?
And what does my heart have to do with it?

AAARrrrrrggghghh!!! <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

I know you didn't make it up and I know you are not a believer but thanks for responding anyway.
I know my questions sound pretty basic to you, but I still need to know.

Janaya

Janaya

Helen,
Thanks for responding.

John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

I have a few questions about this verse.
If all I have to do is believe in God's son, then what is his purpose in dying?
Also, if our only choices are heaven and hell (which last for eternity) then how do we ever perish? Doesn't a hell-dweller have eternal life also?

Thanks,
Janaya