Freethought & Rationalism Archive

lunachick · 01-23-2003, 08:38 PM

Are you for or against it?

Why?

Edit: Damn! Typo in my poll title - if a mod could perhaps fix it? Pretty please...

Gurdur · 01-23-2003, 08:42 PM

I won't vote in the poll, because:

I'm for the death penalty in theory (some people just don't seem to deserve anything else)

and firmly against it in practice (too many innocent people are victims of the death penalty, plus it's a very nasty ethical question anyway)

lunachick · 01-23-2003, 08:51 PM

It is a nasty question, but I was just wondering what most people thought about it, if at all.

Personally, I think if you are going to have a death penalty, then you'd better be damned certain you have the right man/woman!

I'm also wondering how people view the death penalty as a deterrant. What they think should be the method of death should they support the death penalty. And do they think people may use the death penatly as a method of suicide - one which will inevitably take victim/s along with it. And a whole host of other related concerns.

I haven't voted in my poll, either. I guess I couldn't resist the pull to poll the 'basic' question. That way, I hoped to get at least a little feedback, even if someone didn't want to 'reply'.

Doubting Didymus · 01-23-2003, 09:19 PM

In a system where some innocents will be convicted (that is, any legal system imaginable) a death penalty is unconscionable. And also disgusting.

Having said that, I can't understand why "life" scentences are so short. How come in most cases its either death OR 30 odd years? Why does "life" rarely or never mean life?

Strawberry · 01-23-2003, 09:55 PM

The death penalty is brutal and barbaric. IMHO, forcibly taking life from a healthy human being is something I can't even begin to think about. It's awfully easy--too easy, I think--to sit on a jury and sign a death sentance. How many jurors, I wonder, would swing that way on a sentance if they were the ones who would have to carry out the execution themselves (i.e. actually flip the switches and walk the prisoner into the death chamber, etc.)?

It's frightening to me that the U.S. seems to see the capital punishment as lofty justice and firy retribution (see the religious language already?). It gives me chills and makes me nauseous thinking about it. Nobody deserves to have their life taken away, and it would seem to me that it would be setting a better example for would-be murderers to show them that killing other people is so bad that even the government and the courts won't do it. Then again, tell that to Bush. If you ask me, he's the worst serial murderer to come around in a long time, and he doesn't seem to feel any remorse, either.

Ahh, I'm ranting. Must stop. [/rant]

Doesn't help that I just saw "Dancer in the Dark" for the first time last night. I didn't know what it was about, or I wouldn't have watched it.

Edited because I did learn 3rd-grade grammar, honest.

Doubting Didymus · 01-23-2003, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Doesn't help that I just saw "Dancer in the Dark" for the first time last night. I didn't know what it was about, or I wouldn't have watched it.

Ouch.

Viti · 01-23-2003, 10:10 PM

I don't know. I worry about innocents being executed, but then in some cases these people just need to be eliminated from society. Ted Bundy's execution was just IMO....the West Memphis 3 were put on death row with no physical evidence...I just don't know

Amie · 01-23-2003, 10:13 PM

Hi Luna
I am against the death penalty

Doubting Didymus · 01-23-2003, 10:16 PM

To me, its cut and dry. With the death penalty, innocent people will be murdered as a direct result of the legal system. Without the death penalty, no innocent will ever be murdered as a result of said legal system. Its as simple as that.

Justice, you ask? Find. Another. Way.

copernicus · 01-23-2003, 10:55 PM

I oppose the death penalty in principle, and I would not support even if we could guarantee that no innocent person were caused to suffer from it. Don't get me wrong. I have no sympathy for evil people who are executed, and I have even felt that familiar sense of satisfaction that "justice was served" when brutal, sadistic people were executed. However, I recognize that satisfaction for what it is--the satisfaction of revenge. And I think that revenge, while a very human emotion, has a very bad track record for solving problems. It is a dehumanizing kind of satisfaction, and it is a counterproductive emotion in the end.

The problem with the death penalty is that it buys into the motivation of murderers. It affirms the widespread belief that killing is justified on some occasions, and that is a belief that most murderers hold in their minds when they commit their acts. It is just that people in power--and society at large--disagree with the motives of murders, not their methods. On some level, we are agreeing with the murderers. We are just saying that we disagree with their reasons for committing murder.

The death penalty is not a necessary solution, nor is it necessarily more cruel than the alternative--life in prison. Moreover, it has not been show to deter crime any more than alternative punishments. In practice, it has been shown to be administered unfairly and sometimes unjustly. So I oppose the death penalty.

View Poll Results: Are you For or Ggainst the Death Penalty
Yes. I support the death penalty	32	19.88%
No. I do not support the death penalty	120	74.53%
I don't know.	9	5.59%
Voters: 161. You may not vote on this poll

01-23-2003, 08:38 PM	#1
lunachick Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: NZ Posts: 7,895	The Death Penalty Are you for or against it? Why? Edit: Damn! Typo in my poll title - if a mod could perhaps fix it? Pretty please...

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01-23-2003, 08:42 PM	#2
Gurdur Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Buggered if I know Posts: 12,410	I won't vote in the poll, because: I'm for the death penalty in theory (some people just don't seem to deserve anything else) and firmly against it in practice (too many innocent people are victims of the death penalty, plus it's a very nasty ethical question anyway)

01-23-2003, 08:51 PM	#3
lunachick Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: NZ Posts: 7,895	It is a nasty question, but I was just wondering what most people thought about it, if at all. Personally, I think if you are going to have a death penalty, then you'd better be damned certain you have the right man/woman! I'm also wondering how people view the death penalty as a deterrant. What they think should be the method of death should they support the death penalty. And do they think people may use the death penatly as a method of suicide - one which will inevitably take victim/s along with it. And a whole host of other related concerns. I haven't voted in my poll, either. I guess I couldn't resist the pull to poll the 'basic' question. That way, I hoped to get at least a little feedback, even if someone didn't want to 'reply'.

01-23-2003, 09:19 PM	#4
Doubting Didymus Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: East Coast. Australia. Posts: 5,455	In a system where some innocents will be convicted (that is, any legal system imaginable) a death penalty is unconscionable. And also disgusting. Having said that, I can't understand why "life" scentences are so short. How come in most cases its either death OR 30 odd years? Why does "life" rarely or never mean life?

01-23-2003, 09:55 PM	#5
Strawberry Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Lancaster, PA/Toronto, ON, Canada Posts: 627	The death penalty is brutal and barbaric. IMHO, forcibly taking life from a healthy human being is something I can't even begin to think about. It's awfully easy--too easy, I think--to sit on a jury and sign a death sentance. How many jurors, I wonder, would swing that way on a sentance if they were the ones who would have to carry out the execution themselves (i.e. actually flip the switches and walk the prisoner into the death chamber, etc.)? It's frightening to me that the U.S. seems to see the capital punishment as lofty justice and firy retribution (see the religious language already?). It gives me chills and makes me nauseous thinking about it. Nobody deserves to have their life taken away, and it would seem to me that it would be setting a better example for would-be murderers to show them that killing other people is so bad that even the government and the courts won't do it. Then again, tell that to Bush. If you ask me, he's the worst serial murderer to come around in a long time, and he doesn't seem to feel any remorse, either. Ahh, I'm ranting. Must stop. [/rant] Doesn't help that I just saw "Dancer in the Dark" for the first time last night. I didn't know what it was about, or I wouldn't have watched it. Edited because I did learn 3rd-grade grammar, honest.

01-23-2003, 10:10 PM	#7
Viti Contributor Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Down South Posts: 12,879	I don't know. I worry about innocents being executed, but then in some cases these people just need to be eliminated from society. Ted Bundy's execution was just IMO....the West Memphis 3 were put on death row with no physical evidence...I just don't know

01-23-2003, 10:13 PM	#8
Amie Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: New York Posts: 1,626	Hi Luna I am against the death penalty

01-23-2003, 10:16 PM	#9
Doubting Didymus Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: East Coast. Australia. Posts: 5,455	To me, its cut and dry. With the death penalty, innocent people will be murdered as a direct result of the legal system. Without the death penalty, no innocent will ever be murdered as a result of said legal system. Its as simple as that. Justice, you ask? Find. Another. Way.

01-23-2003, 10:55 PM	#10
copernicus Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Bellevue, WA Posts: 1,531	I oppose the death penalty in principle, and I would not support even if we could guarantee that no innocent person were caused to suffer from it. Don't get me wrong. I have no sympathy for evil people who are executed, and I have even felt that familiar sense of satisfaction that "justice was served" when brutal, sadistic people were executed. However, I recognize that satisfaction for what it is--the satisfaction of revenge. And I think that revenge, while a very human emotion, has a very bad track record for solving problems. It is a dehumanizing kind of satisfaction, and it is a counterproductive emotion in the end. The problem with the death penalty is that it buys into the motivation of murderers. It affirms the widespread belief that killing is justified on some occasions, and that is a belief that most murderers hold in their minds when they commit their acts. It is just that people in power--and society at large--disagree with the motives of murders, not their methods. On some level, we are agreeing with the murderers. We are just saying that we disagree with their reasons for committing murder. The death penalty is not a necessary solution, nor is it necessarily more cruel than the alternative--life in prison. Moreover, it has not been show to deter crime any more than alternative punishments. In practice, it has been shown to be administered unfairly and sometimes unjustly. So I oppose the death penalty.

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