Vespertine

This event occured on Friday, February 28th, 2003. I found it to be very very interesting and thought that I would share it.

It was during an 8:00am Music History Lab and we were discussing a piece, I think it was from a Mass or something religious, and a friend wanted to share her ideas. Before she went into her explaination that the work was in praise to God, yadda yadda, she happened to say, "Do not beat me up for saying this..."

What I wanted to know is this: What has happened in our society that would cause her to say such a thing? Could a lowly Montana University be fairly secular, enough to warrant this comment? Has anyone else experienced something similiar to this?

I do know that most of us (the music majors) don't go to church regularly as well as some of us being full fledged atheists, but why would a Christian be afraid to say what they think?

Mageth

My guess is that it came from something in her personal experience.

davidH

If you look around on this site or if you stick around and read stuff - you will see that there's a lot of abuse given to Christians.
In some conversations people will burst out in anger or a torrent of abuse just because someone says what they think based on their beliefs.

You have no idea of the discrimination. Especially amoungst lecturers in Universities - some while discussing things on the internet will not give their identity - even if it would allow people to see what authority they had on the subject. Reason - if they knew they would lose their jobs.

It's basically because some people really resent Christianity and it gets them going if anything is mentioned in their presence.

Ensign Steve

I got something similar in another bulletin board I belong to. A woman apologized for being exceptionally "prayerful" in her recent posts, and hoped that she was not offending anybody. A very sweet sentiment, but unnecessary in my opinion. It scares me because I think she probably sees all of the same propaganda that we see, about how the big-bad atheists have an agenda to remove god and religion and faith from every aspect of life. I started to compose an email to her about how it is not our "agenda" to prevent people from praying or believing in god, it is just our goal to keep religion separate from tax-funded institutions like public schools and the white house. I actually opted out of sending the email before I finished composing it, because I didn't want to miss-speak for anybody else on that board who may have actually been offended by her prayerfulness.

My mom was also surprised at the fact that I took no offense to my personal trainer at the gym saying that we honor god by taking care of our bodies. Like I said, I can't speak for others, but I am amazed at the amount of things people think would offend me that don't. *sigh*

Like I said, I think it is that propaganda, created by xians, that all atheists are anti-god and want to expunge the world of anything religious. What's next, am I going to ask for all religious artwork to be removed from the Smithsonian? Give me a little credit!

Jen

wildernesse

You read it here first! I knew it! AAAaahhh! ah.

--tibac

Shake

Well, I don't fully agree with davidH's post. I think that the Xians like to feel that they're the ones being persecuted. Maybe it's habit ... leftover sentiment from centuries gone by, when Xians were more of a minority and were persecuted by folks like the Romans. I seriously have a hard time giving any sympathy to Xians who claim persecution today. :boohoo: They're the ones actually doing the persecuting nowadays!

OTOH, Jen alluded to the point that some people are just sensitive to offending others. This has become much more commonplace in today's politically correct world. It is more than a bit ridiculous. I'm sure your friend didn't literlly fear being "beaten up," but didn't want to unintentionally provoke you into a verbal assault on her views. There's being sensitive to the feelings of others, and then there's PC, which has gone WAY too far! (IMHO)

Mageth

If you look around on this site or if you stick around and read stuff - you will see that there's a lot of abuse given to Christians.
In some conversations people will burst out in anger or a torrent of abuse just because someone says what they think based on their beliefs.

Typically, such abuse is directed at drive-by, preachy types who come here trying to "save" us heathens and telling us all about heaven and hell (where we're destined if we don't come to our senses and agree with them). Rarely does such occur in more reasonable conversations here.

You have no idea of the discrimination.

You're right; in a country that is at least 80% Christian, and where the President and other politicians routinely make heavily religious speeches, I have no idea where xians get the idea that they are a persecuted and discriminated-against minority.

Especially amoungst lecturers in Universities - some while discussing things on the internet will not give their identity - even if it would allow people to see what authority they had on the subject. Reason - if they knew they would lose their jobs.

List for me all the professors you know who have lost their jobs because of expression of their religious beliefs.

It's basically because some people really resent Christianity and it gets them going if anything is mentioned in their presence.

You should try telling the local Baptist congregation that "God doesn't exist. You all believe a myth." Or expressing atheistic views on a Xian board (if you can find one that allows atheists as members, which some don't).

Ensign Steve

On this site? NOOOOOO! You don't say!

And if you look around a Church and pay attention to their conversations, you will see that there's a lot of abuse given to atheists, gays, Jews, and (dare I say it?) women.

Outside of this site, you will find that most of the so-called abuse that xians face is made up.

I believe the original post was talking about in a university situation, not about a bulletin board specifically created to be a gathering place of people who don't believe in any god, much less the xian one. Think about the context.



Jen

philechat

As a matter of fact, I don't care at all to speak out the purpose of a piece of music or poem. If it is indeed a piece of theology, praising God or whatnot, then it is. If it is a piece taken from the Bible, then it comes from the Bible. Why would it offend someone when we speak of the truth? And I am an atheist.

However, in the field of classical music, it is actually quite typical of an atheist/agnostic composer to write Christian pieces, simply because he likes the musical forms. The Verdi requiem and Brahms' "Ein Deutsch Requiem" are such example of successful religious pieces written by composers who were in fact irreligious.

Vespertine

I think I was particularly interested in the possibility that our society is moving towards the secular side of the spectrum. Also, I'm only guessing, really, but aren't some other countries way ahead of the US in moving secular?