Freethought & Rationalism Archive

crownboy · 09-03-2002, 03:00 PM

Does our body show "intelligent design" in the way we metabolize food? I mean, wouldn't an intelligent designer make sure that our bodies were capable of using virtually 100% of the food we take in, and not have "waste products"? Think of how many less people would starve, etc. if one meal could suffice for a maximal amount of nourishment from the intake. Hell, for that matter, why would an "intelligent designer" even create us with a need for food? That would definitely solve all starvation problems.

Plebe · 09-03-2002, 03:11 PM

LOL! Argument from Diarrhea, I love it!

As anyone with a background in science knows, the human body evinces evolution from the most basic one celled organism through to vertebrate. Our digestive tracts, well, certainly part and parcel of the coelenterate stage of evolution and then some!
With respect to intelligent design arguments, let's see what theists on the list say and then we can talk about 'crappy' design[and I'm not talking about Crapper's invention, the toilet either!]

luvluv · 09-03-2002, 03:16 PM

It's a fallacy to assume that a perfect creator would make OUR world perfect. I don't think Christianity ever makes the claim that our world is perfect, only good.

Now if they're crapping up a storm in heaven, then you've got an argument.

Mageth · 09-03-2002, 03:29 PM

It's a fallacy to assume that a perfect creator would make OUR world perfect.

How could a creator who made an imperfect creation be "perfect?" How do you define perfect?

luvluv · 09-03-2002, 04:06 PM

Well, I would argue that whether or not a thing is perfect depends on the ends of it's existence. Perfection is not an entity like, for instance, redness, which is always the same. A rock may make a perfect paperweight, but it would be a lousy basketball. So, when discussing perfection, we must ask, perfect for what?

I can't speak for other religions, but the Bible makes it pretty clear that humans are not meant to live in this world forever without discomfort. If God INTENDED for this world to be absolutely perfect purely for thermodynamic efficiency, then we would be right to criticize his perfection on the grounds that we were not 100 percent efficient. But if He created us for a different purpose, then the fact that we aren't perfect creations is really not relevant. The question is do we do what we are designed to do perfectly?

Also, Christianity is pretty explicit that the planet Earth is not the best God can do. Heaven is supposed to be much "better" at least in terms of our happiness and probably the efficiency of our ressurected bodies. And it is not ever explicitly expressed in the Bible or anywhere in Christian tradition that heaven is even the best God can do. It may be the best place finite beings can experience.

At any rate, Christianity, at least, never makes the claim that the world or humans are perfect.

[ September 03, 2002: Message edited by: luvluv ]</p>

Mad Kally · 09-03-2002, 04:14 PM

Quote:

posted by luvluv:
It's a fallacy to assume that a perfect creator would make OUR world perfect. I don't think Christianity ever makes the claim that our world is perfect, only good.

I'm a nurse and there is such a thing as a perfect bowel movement.

luvluv · 09-03-2002, 04:25 PM

And how.

phlebas · 09-03-2002, 04:39 PM

Very cute, but not for here

Off to... hmmmm... Misc Religion Discussions, I think.

B. H. Manners · 09-03-2002, 04:51 PM

[ September 03, 2002: Message edited by: BH ]</p>

09-03-2002, 03:00 PM	#1
crownboy Regular Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: NYC, New York Posts: 114	Argument from diaherra Does our body show "intelligent design" in the way we metabolize food? I mean, wouldn't an intelligent designer make sure that our bodies were capable of using virtually 100% of the food we take in, and not have "waste products"? Think of how many less people would starve, etc. if one meal could suffice for a maximal amount of nourishment from the intake. Hell, for that matter, why would an "intelligent designer" even create us with a need for food? That would definitely solve all starvation problems.

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09-03-2002, 03:11 PM	#2
Plebe Regular Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Contra Costa County Posts: 168	LOL! Argument from Diarrhea, I love it! As anyone with a background in science knows, the human body evinces evolution from the most basic one celled organism through to vertebrate. Our digestive tracts, well, certainly part and parcel of the coelenterate stage of evolution and then some! With respect to intelligent design arguments, let's see what theists on the list say and then we can talk about 'crappy' design[and I'm not talking about Crapper's invention, the toilet either!]

09-03-2002, 03:16 PM	#3
luvluv Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Planet Lovetron Posts: 3,919	It's a fallacy to assume that a perfect creator would make OUR world perfect. I don't think Christianity ever makes the claim that our world is perfect, only good. Now if they're crapping up a storm in heaven, then you've got an argument.

09-03-2002, 03:29 PM	#4
Mageth Contributor Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Deep in the heart of mother-lovin' Texas Posts: 29,689	It's a fallacy to assume that a perfect creator would make OUR world perfect. How could a creator who made an imperfect creation be "perfect?" How do you define perfect?

09-03-2002, 04:06 PM	#5
luvluv Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Planet Lovetron Posts: 3,919	Well, I would argue that whether or not a thing is perfect depends on the ends of it's existence. Perfection is not an entity like, for instance, redness, which is always the same. A rock may make a perfect paperweight, but it would be a lousy basketball. So, when discussing perfection, we must ask, perfect for what? I can't speak for other religions, but the Bible makes it pretty clear that humans are not meant to live in this world forever without discomfort. If God INTENDED for this world to be absolutely perfect purely for thermodynamic efficiency, then we would be right to criticize his perfection on the grounds that we were not 100 percent efficient. But if He created us for a different purpose, then the fact that we aren't perfect creations is really not relevant. The question is do we do what we are designed to do perfectly? Also, Christianity is pretty explicit that the planet Earth is not the best God can do. Heaven is supposed to be much "better" at least in terms of our happiness and probably the efficiency of our ressurected bodies. And it is not ever explicitly expressed in the Bible or anywhere in Christian tradition that heaven is even the best God can do. It may be the best place finite beings can experience. At any rate, Christianity, at least, never makes the claim that the world or humans are perfect. [ September 03, 2002: Message edited by: luvluv ]</p>

09-03-2002, 04:25 PM	#7
luvluv Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Planet Lovetron Posts: 3,919	And how.

09-03-2002, 04:39 PM	#8
phlebas Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Metropolis Posts: 916	Very cute, but not for here Off to... hmmmm... Misc Religion Discussions, I think.

09-03-2002, 04:51 PM	#9
B. H. Manners Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 1,213	[ September 03, 2002: Message edited by: BH ]</p>

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