Pomp

Who says I dont?

Koyaanisqatsi

Yes. What do I win?



Why would a bear hunter--who set the trap initially--want to help us?

Clues like a talking, burning bush, for example? Or the parting of the red sea? Or the dead rising from their graves? Or a global flood?

Are those the kinds of little, insignificant clues that you are implying God is not allowed to show us above on a regular, every day basis because it would somehow effect our free will?

It was perfectly fine for God to trifurcate into flesh two thousand years ago in order to kill himself as a sacrifice to himself in order to save all of us from himself, but that was his last parlor trick? Is that what you're trying to get at?

The same place we "get" every other standard humanity has ever had; from empathy/sympathy and personal experience living within a tribe/community, aka, ourselves.

It's the same place all of the simplistic lies of the christian cult came from.

Unless, of course, the moment of creaTION happened as a result of something like a tremendous explosion of an unstable singularity, but why muddy all of this fine back home jug talkin' with fancy book learnin'? When's the hoe down, and I ain't talkin' 'bout Ellie May?

Just to chime in with everyone else, WHAT?



Boy, it just never ceases to amaze me how easily ignorant people are manipulated by such profoundly stupid things.



Yes, and, as a child, I believed Santa Exists. What's your point?

Making a burning bush actually speak is not possible. Making a woman out of just a rib is not possible. Resurrecting from the dead is not possible. Flooding the entire Earth is not possible. Stopping the Sun in the sky is not possible.

Yet "he" is supposed to have done all of those things, right?

Well, then, I guess that negates the "all-powerful" claim, now doesn't it?

Why not? He made them both, didn't he? The guy can make a human out of dirt and blink the entire universe into existence, but he can't make "good" evil?

Then why did he have to kill us all off in a global flood?

And you can't have Halloween without pumpkins!

That means absolutely nothing. Without first creating evil there would be no "possibility of" evil, yes? Are these people you got these things from capable of tying their own shoelaces yet?

Created by God's power. I bet these people enjoy the merry-go-round.

Must it now? I thought God was "all powerful."

Boy, that quality just keeps gettin more and more limited.

Tell me then, oh great sophist, since God is love doesn't that also mean he's hate, too?

Then who created sin? You mean, we did? Wow, imagine that.

We created something that God didn't.

But I thought God created everything....

That's right, goddamn it! God had nothing to do with it! That's why he throws us all into an eternal lake of fire for creating something that he could only manage the possibility of....

These are quite simply the stupidest arguments I've ever addressed here, but it's kind of fun.

That's right! Best stay at home forever mumbling in the dark your prayers to your God.

[Questionable comment deleted. -PB]

Apparently not, or he would have known all about that possibility of loophole!

The jerk!

How could he if he didn't create evil, just the possibility of evil...?

Yeeeessss...?

You mean, like he did on a constant and cataclysmic level to every single person on the planet five to two thousand years ago?

Well, at least they spelled the word "intellectually" correctly. That's about all the points they get correct so far.[/quote]

How does an all powerful God die?

I guess that just another example of him being not all that powerful, right?

What tragedy?

Did he now. He "saw" that but didn't just know that?

Yes, a guy died. What a wonderful event.

What "ultimate evil?" Don't you mean, "ultimate possibility of evil?"

With the possibility of evil?

And we don't punish them eternally in a burning lake of fire for disobeying us.

There's a song in that.

Does that also mean that not being "good" is being "evil?"

And they were all homosexual pedophiles, so I guess they should know!

So true, so true...

And God made a man out of dirt! With the possibility of evil...

God didn't. He committed global genocide (twice, I think, if you factor in the gap in Genesis) and still had to send himself down to kill himself as a required sacrifice by himself to himself in order to grant us the salvation from himself.

Boy, that is one heinously powerless, all-powerful being!

Ok, enough of this childish horseshit. Time to go.

[ July 24, 2002: Message edited by: Koyaanisqatsi ]</p>

Mad Kally

Preach it Brother Koy! <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

scumble

What's the use if Kalestia isn't replying? We all agree here!

Koyaanisqatsi

"Use?" I was just having some fun.

luvluv

Philosoft:

I'm paraphrasing C.S. Lewis here, but if there is a best way to do something, how can omniscience fail to ascertain it, and how could omnipotence fail to implement it?

In other words, if the current state of affairs is the best one possible to ascertain God's goals, how can his omnipotence or omniscience help him past that? It is logically impossible for even Omniscience and Omnipotence to come up with a way to do something that is better than the best way.

Philosoft

Because now you have a standard and you have God's actions. If God created the standard, then the objection still holds because God is free to create any arbitrary standard God wishes. If God didn't create the standard, you've got much bigger philosophical problems.

<strong> See above.

<strong> Unless the omni- thing created the standard in the first place.

HRG

Coming up with it is one thing. Actually doing it is another.

HRG.

Steven Carr

God created all things. Therefore he created evil (and sustains evil). And Christians believe he created human nature. Therefore , he created us with the desire to sin, just as he created us with no desire to walk around backwards on our hands and knees. He has created beings with free will that he knew would never choose evil (at least Christians assure me he did), so why not create us like that?

Steven Carr

Kalestia does not know very much about Christianity.

Christians maintain that God has created angels like Michael and Gabriel who have free will and have never sinned. Therefore, he could have created more beings like that, or only beings like that. God is more of an underachiever, than somebody evil.