Amos

Of course Luther was one of them and should have never even been allowed to read the bible because in the end that is what send him to hell.

The supernatural is the enemy only if you try to fornicate your way into heaven. You will admid that the supernatural has no hold on you and why should it? You are untouchable and that is your choice. You have the right to choose and no Catholic will disagree with you here--although he might just remind you that you will die, just as Luther did, with the only difference that you will not die with the burning with desire to be united with God.

The Church is not stupid and still holds the key to the kingdom, and, though I think we went throught this once before, let me remind you here that marauders are not allowed in and since only Catholics can be invited to the royal banquet others will always have to brew from their own recipy.

I think those guys with red robes and pointed hats are to be pitied for they too must find their own way while in obedience to the Church out of respect for its infinite wisdom in matters regarding the salvation of souls. I wish more of them did pay attention and not look so much across the fence at the vainglory of man-made religions (we're inspired).

As for the adoption of pre-Catholic means and ways. Who cares as long as it served them well and this we all know it did--or they would not still be the envy of the world. I should add here that religion is like a vehicle that leads to a desired end and after this it's over and finished. This being the case it don't matter much what you load it up with as long as you can use it towards the right end, and, may I remind you here once again, this desired end is only known to the Catholic Church (and Judaism or Jesus would have never made it). The question now becomes, how dare anybody critisize the Church?

Must go, sorry and thanks.

Amos

Hi Veil of Fire, thanks for your exposition. That is about what I had in mind.

sullster

Amos,
You know where I stand about your views, but I do get a kick out of reading and reacting to them. You make me concentrate my thinking and maybe be a bit humorous too. We don't seem to really connect but then so what.

I am going to be off-line for a week or so, so don't think I am gone.

Take care, you medieval mind, you.

Your friend, Sullster

Ales

7) Front Groups: Number of subsidiary groups using different names from that of main group, especially when connections are hidden."

I don't know... I think everything that's Catholic is brightly labeled as such, so that'll be low unless I find out something new. Give it a 1.


I don’t think so. Remember the holy mafia “Opus Dei” called also “Octopus Dei “. I think there is a lot of catholic organizations that don’t have this word in their name and the link can be established only after a close examination. There are groups with nice names such as “League for Family”, “Guardiands of Life” or “Spotless Youth” that are ultracatholics but don’t want let us know. There are many books with nice names such as “True knowledge”, “Natural role of women” or “History of mankind” that are written by Catholics who do not disclose their background and their aims to promote Catholicism under its name. I would give it a 10.


"12) Isolation: Amount of effort to keep members from communicating with non-members, including family, friends and lovers."


In the case of Church employees 10. Priests are usually trained in a ghetto called a seminary in a complete isolation from the outer world. They are often allowed to leave the seminary once a week for few hours but it can vary. Monks and nuns are usually obliged not to leave the monastery or convent at all, it also varies but the amount of isolation is generally extremely high and often an isolation from all other community members is required, sometimes speaking is also forbidden.


"17) Surrender of Will: Amount of emphasis on members not having to be responsible for personal decisions; degree of individual disempowerment created by the group, its doctrines or its leader(s)."


Again I would give it a 10. The strong emphasis on obedience to the Church doctrine is what is sometimes considered to be a point in which Protestantism and Catholicism differ. Protestants are said to set a value to the individual conscience but for Catholic obedience to authority was always the most important virtue. (In the light of the famous Milgram’s experiment it is no wonder that Catholic Church is such an evil organization.)

[ August 10, 2002: Message edited by: Ales ]</p>

Bible Humper

Hello Amos,

Could you explain that?

DMB

I was going to post about Opus Dei, but Ales beat me to it. It certainly ups catholicism's score.
{edited to correct my abysmal typing}

[ August 11, 2002: Message edited by: DMB ]</p>

PopeInTheWoods

Also in support of Ales and his "front groups" assertion, Catholic hospitals buy other hospitals, clinics, surgery centers, and other health care facilities, often don't change the names, and quietly eliminate their reproductive planning services.

Andy

Amos

Well certainly and sorry for being late with my answer. There are many ways to go about this and I realy do not know you well enough to just give the short anwer.

Maybe you have heard the expression that it is a fearfull thing to fall in the hands of the living God. Of course this is true and I think the bible also speaks about not trying to build a house on quicksand or brushwood or whatever because all will wash away and become a waste of time and effort. In other words, make sure you can finish what you start.

It is actually much worse than that and is probably why there are soo many disgruntled atheist on this board. Most of them have had their fill of religion and are actually sorry they have ever been exposed to it.

I think the bible talks about "cold" being good and "hot" being good but "lukewarm" is not good. Cold is good because those that are cold have never "entered the race." They are not "born again" and are probably just good people that go to church if they have time etc. Good old Catholics come to mind here.

Then there are those that have entered the race, are born again and but can't seem to work out their own salvation and have to die before anything good happens to them. They have fallen into the hands of the living God (just ask them). Some have seen the light and will boast about their salvation to no end. The'll go preach because they think that what they have you should have and because they, at one time, did not know that you could have a personal relationship with God untill they "received" that you can't know how good it feels until you "receive" (because they think that you are as ignorant as they once were), etc. This is what makes them so persitent.

Their problem is that they have "entered the race before its own time" (Songs 2:7) in in doing so have actually fornicated (my term) their own spritual virginity (this gets more complicated so I'll leave it for now). They have been born again in an untimely way out of human desire and not according to the will of God. Jn.1:13 is clear on this and explains that there are two kinds of rebirth possible. One is of God and the other is from carnal desire. If you are born from carnal desire (in response to parents, altar calls, girlfriends etc.), it will be premature and you will be a new creation indeed but you will be much like a butterfly without wings and thus you'll never sore with wings of an eagle. You'll have one leg in heaven and one on earth and will burn scriptures until you die because the light you have received is not of God but from the "angel of light" (maybe this term is familiar to you), and this light must be refreshed daily. The children of Israel had this problem and so they died because of it.

In the end the problem is that they are on fire for the Lord, but the Lord is not on fire for them, in fact, he will deny them when their time comes and "know them not" (that's also in the bible someplace). They have been given a scorpion instead of a fish is another one of those friendly reminders that salvation is just the beginning.

In literature they are called Senecan Tragedies as opposed to Divine Comedies. Both have a crisis moment and only Comedies have a resurrection that follows. The tragedies hope to resurrect after they die and therefore must be enslaved until they die. Hence their supernatural influence of evil.

GunnerJ

You know, I thought for sure this was going to be a great Gamma Therease thread. I was looking forward to seeing her pop up.

How dissapointing that we have to settle for a semi-coherent half-troll. <img src="graemlins/boohoo.gif" border="0" alt="[Boo Hoo]" />