Freethought & Rationalism Archive

thebeave · 11-21-2002, 12:23 PM

Everybody seems to be throwing this phrase around these days like its meaning is obvious, but I just don't get it. Have the sheep who bleat this out every day really sat down and thought just what the heck they are asking (or telling?) God to do? Does God just wave his arms and we are instantly "blessed" (whatever that is?). If and when, in fact, God does bless America, are we protected from harm? If so, why doesn't it work? How would you know if the blessing did work and wasn't due to random good luck? When he blesses America, does he use Holy Water?

Theists help!!

Krieger · 11-21-2002, 12:32 PM

They're asking Yahweh to bless America. It is not "ceremonial deism"...

Autonemesis · 11-21-2002, 12:32 PM

I have related puzzler that theists might be able to explain as well: what does it mean to "give Glory to God?" This action implies that I possess something that God wants or needs, or that He is somehow impoverished if I withhold it. But that seems to fly in the face of the idea of a perfect God. If He wants or needs something I have, then He is lacking and cannot be perfect.

So what is "Glory" and why do I need to "give it" to God? Doesn't everything that exist already belong to God? If so, then he already posesses the glory that I only think is mine to give Him. That it is mine to give Him is surely an illusion, isn't it?

Can this be explained, too? It seems as empty and vacuous a thing to say as "God Bless America."

sullster · 11-21-2002, 02:29 PM

I can't really understand what it means but this god sure is busy all over.

The Germans during WW2 said, "God is with us". If that was true, this god has some explaining to do.

The British always say,"God Save the Queen". I am not sure what that means either. Save her from what or for what? Strange.

ageofreason2000 · 11-21-2002, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sullster:
<strong>The British always say,"God Save the Queen". I am not sure what that means either. Save her from what or for what? Strange.</strong>

Please don't paraphrase:

The full sentence is "god save the queen and her fascist regime".

(courtesy to the Sex Pistols)

CALDONIA · 11-21-2002, 03:41 PM

It seems that the phrase, "God Bless America" is current usually during times of war or some calamity. There is an implied sense that while God is asked to bless America, God is at the same time being asked to damn them or it, or at the very least, show America some favoritism in whatever battle, war, or crisis is current.

I think the phrase comes mostly from that maudlin, half-rate song of the same name, written by Irving Berlin. A Tin Pan alley tune is not really suitable for anthem status, at any rate.

Philosoft · 11-21-2002, 05:05 PM

Whatever it is, apparently asking God to bless America isn't specific enough. Witness Christians who ask God to bless individual family members, football players who pray before, during, and after games (touchdowns, even). The list goes on.

Christian: God bless America!
God: Right, thanks and all, but there are lots of little things within the whole that is America. Could you be more specific?
C: Sure! Bless my mom, my dad...
[Time passes]
C: God bless America!
G: Look, I thought I made this clear last time...

11-21-2002, 05:48 PM

Why hasn't anyone ever said God Bless Earth? Are most Americans really so arrogant that they only want the deity to bless their little section of the planet?

Krieger · 11-21-2002, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by atheist_in_foxhole:
Are most Americans really so arrogant that they only want the deity to bless their little section of the planet?

Sadly, yes.

Toto · 11-21-2002, 07:55 PM

<a href="http://www.jitterbuzz.com/ambless.html" target="_blank">God Bless America</a>

Quote:

The original version of "God Bless America" was written by Irving Berlin (1888-1989) during the summer of 1918 at Camp Upton, located in Yaphank, Long Island, for his Ziegfeld-style revue, Yip, Yip, Yaphank.

"Make her victorious on land and foam, God Bless America..." ran the original lyric.

However, Berlin decided that the solemn tone of "God Bless America" was somewhat out of keeping with the more comedic elements of the show and the song was laid aside.

In the fall of 1938, as war was again threatening Europe, Berlin decided to write a "peace" song. He recalled his "God Bless America" from twenty years earlier and made some alterations to reflect the different state of the world. Singer Kate Smith introduced the revised "God Bless America" during her radio broadcast on Armistice Day, 1938. The song was an immediate sensation; the sheet music was in great demand. Berlin soon established the God Bless America Fund, dedicating the royalties to the Boy and Girl Scouts of America.

So it looks like Irving Berlin's idea of God blessing America was to give America military victory, which is of course the usual fuction of a God (as in the Old Testmant.)

Nowadays, you can argue that it doesn't mean much of anything - just a general wish for good fortune.

11-21-2002, 12:23 PM	#1
thebeave Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Silicon Valley, CA Posts: 4,183	What, exactly, does God Bless America mean? Everybody seems to be throwing this phrase around these days like its meaning is obvious, but I just don't get it. Have the sheep who bleat this out every day really sat down and thought just what the heck they are asking (or telling?) God to do? Does God just wave his arms and we are instantly "blessed" (whatever that is?). If and when, in fact, God does bless America, are we protected from harm? If so, why doesn't it work? How would you know if the blessing did work and wasn't due to random good luck? When he blesses America, does he use Holy Water? Theists help!!

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11-21-2002, 12:32 PM	#2
Krieger Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: ... Posts: 2,191	They're asking Yahweh to bless America. It is not "ceremonial deism"...

11-21-2002, 12:32 PM	#3
Autonemesis Contributor Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: I've left FRDB for good, due to new WI&P policy Posts: 12,048	I have related puzzler that theists might be able to explain as well: what does it mean to "give Glory to God?" This action implies that I possess something that God wants or needs, or that He is somehow impoverished if I withhold it. But that seems to fly in the face of the idea of a perfect God. If He wants or needs something I have, then He is lacking and cannot be perfect. So what is "Glory" and why do I need to "give it" to God? Doesn't everything that exist already belong to God? If so, then he already posesses the glory that I only think is mine to give Him. That it is mine to give Him is surely an illusion, isn't it? Can this be explained, too? It seems as empty and vacuous a thing to say as "God Bless America."

11-21-2002, 02:29 PM	#4
sullster Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: North of Boston Posts: 1,392	I can't really understand what it means but this god sure is busy all over. The Germans during WW2 said, "God is with us". If that was true, this god has some explaining to do. The British always say,"God Save the Queen". I am not sure what that means either. Save her from what or for what? Strange.

11-21-2002, 03:41 PM	#6
CALDONIA Regular Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sunnyvale,CA Posts: 371	It seems that the phrase, "God Bless America" is current usually during times of war or some calamity. There is an implied sense that while God is asked to bless America, God is at the same time being asked to damn them or it, or at the very least, show America some favoritism in whatever battle, war, or crisis is current. I think the phrase comes mostly from that maudlin, half-rate song of the same name, written by Irving Berlin. A Tin Pan alley tune is not really suitable for anthem status, at any rate.

11-21-2002, 05:05 PM	#7
Philosoft Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Southeast of disorder Posts: 6,829	Whatever it is, apparently asking God to bless America isn't specific enough. Witness Christians who ask God to bless individual family members, football players who pray before, during, and after games (touchdowns, even). The list goes on. Christian: God bless America! God: Right, thanks and all, but there are lots of little things within the whole that is America. Could you be more specific? C: Sure! Bless my mom, my dad... [Time passes] C: God bless America! G: Look, I thought I made this clear last time...

11-21-2002, 05:48 PM	#8
atheist_in_foxhole Guest Posts: n/a	Why hasn't anyone ever said God Bless Earth? Are most Americans really so arrogant that they only want the deity to bless their little section of the planet?

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