Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Hubzilla · 12-17-2002, 02:59 AM

My favorite single contradiction:

1 Corinthians 15:4-5

For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, and that he appeared to Peter, and then to the Twelve. (NIV)

(bolding mine). What happened to Judas?

The usual apologist angle is the "the Twelve" refers to the apostles, whether there are 12 or 11 (hence the capital letters). Of course, in Mark 16 and Luke 24, they are called "the Eleven" in caps.

Another fun one is Psalm 137:8-9

O Daughter of Babylon, doomed to destruction,
happy is he who repays you
for what you have done to us-
he who seizes your infants
and dashes them against the rocks.

Clutch · 12-17-2002, 05:27 AM

doc58,

I suspect that the "proof of virginity" would be the bedsheet or some special sorta drop-cloth used on the wedding-night: the rupture of the hymen causes some bleeding, and then the cloth (from the sound of it) goes into the keeping of the bride's family for legalistic reasons. Hence they "spread the cloth" for the judges.

Of course, many times the hymen is ruptured in youth by all sorts of non-sexual events, or is even non-existent to start with. So this is a method that will produce a lot of false positives for premarital promiscuity, which an omniscient god might have mentioned. On the other hand, it's only women who get victimized by a false positive -- nothing really to worry about, for a morally perfect god...

jess · 12-17-2002, 06:44 AM

Quote:

Actually...Judas himself did not buy the field. IIRC the Bible states that he returned the money to the temple authorities before hanging himself, and the money was then used to buy burial grounds.

This is all sketchy since it's been awhile since I've read through that part, but that's what I remember.

SS: it says that he both bought the land himself and that he gave the money to the temple. Regardless of how he died, you can't both use and give away the same money.

my favorite so far?

Judges 19: (KJV)

Quote:

23 And the man, the master of the house, went out unto them, and said unto them, Nay, my brethren, nay, I pray you, do not so wickedly; seeing that this man is come into mine house, do not this folly.
24 Behold, here is my daughter a maiden, and his concubine; them I will bring out now, and humble ye them, and do with them what seemeth good unto you: but unto this man do not so vile a thing.
25 But the men would not hearken to him: so the man took his concubine, and brought her forth unto them; and they knew her, and abused her all the night until the morning: and when the day began to spring, they let her go.
26 Then came the woman in the dawning of the day, and fell down at the door of the man's house where her lord was, till it was light.
27 And her lord rose up in the morning, and opened the doors of the house, and went out to go his way: and, behold, the woman his concubine was fallen down at the door of the house, and her hands were upon the threshold.
28 And he said unto her, Up, and let us be going. But none answered. Then the man took her up upon an ass, and the man rose up, and gat him unto his place.
29 And when he was come into his house, he took a knife, and laid hold on his concubine, and divided her, together with her bones, into twelve pieces, and sent her into all the coasts of Israel.

nice, huh?

Born Free · 12-17-2002, 07:09 AM

I don't have a bible to hand to give you the verse no but I know that in the very first chapter he makes men and women and sends them "forth to multiply".

In the second chapter he sees there is nobody to till the earth in his glorious garden so he makes adam then from him eve. This inconsistency right at the start made the alarm bells ring and they never stopped.

How could this omni everything god forget he'd already made humans???

I'll get back later if you need verse nos.

Jerry · 12-17-2002, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by AJ113:
I am researching in order to compile a top ten bible "difficulties."

Would you be kind enough to post details of your favourite one? You know, the one that "says it all," the one that gives you the most reason to dismiss the bible.

It could be a contradiction, a fallacy or just a plain old outrage.

I know that there are many to chose from, but I would appreciate it if you could limit your contribution to one in number, so make it a good one!

Thank you in advance,

Adrian

The fact that NOWHERE does the bible condemn slavery. There are many verses that regulate it, however. It is, or should be, a well-known fact that many religionists used the bible to support slavery before, during and after the U.S. Civil War.

Bumble Bee Tuna · 12-17-2002, 09:15 AM

The Easter Challenge. There's just so much contradictory there to begin with. Then tack on that it's THE central story of Christianity, and it becomes quite humorous. I really haven't studied inconsistencies in great detail, however, so I'm sure there are more amusing ones out there. I do like that Exodus Horse/Cattle stuff...

-B

AJ113 · 12-17-2002, 01:38 PM

Many thanks, each.

Any more for any more?

CALDONIA · 12-17-2002, 01:58 PM

Well, as for Bible difficulties, even as a child I was skeptical about that whole Noah's Ark story. Even bad science fiction must have some plausibility. The tortured "explanations" of the physical possibility of the tale from creationists is simultaneously sad and laughable.

12-17-2002, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by alli:

How could this omni everything god forget he'd already made humans???

I'll get back later if you need verse nos.

Psst, alli, in Gen.1 he made man and not humans or humans would be in the image of God.

Clarice O'C · 12-17-2002, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by AJ113:
Many thanks, each.

Any more for any more?

Hi!

I have one that I hope for an answer to.
If Jesus was God's son, who did God have
sex with?

Thanks,
Clarice

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12-17-2002, 02:59 AM	#41
Hubzilla Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Honolulu, Hawaii Posts: 24	My favorite single contradiction: 1 Corinthians 15:4-5 For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, and that he appeared to Peter, and then to the Twelve. (NIV) (bolding mine). What happened to Judas? The usual apologist angle is the "the Twelve" refers to the apostles, whether there are 12 or 11 (hence the capital letters). Of course, in Mark 16 and Luke 24, they are called "the Eleven" in caps. Another fun one is Psalm 137:8-9 O Daughter of Babylon, doomed to destruction, happy is he who repays you for what you have done to us- he who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks.

12-17-2002, 05:27 AM	#42
Clutch Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Canada Posts: 3,751	doc58, I suspect that the "proof of virginity" would be the bedsheet or some special sorta drop-cloth used on the wedding-night: the rupture of the hymen causes some bleeding, and then the cloth (from the sound of it) goes into the keeping of the bride's family for legalistic reasons. Hence they "spread the cloth" for the judges. Of course, many times the hymen is ruptured in youth by all sorts of non-sexual events, or is even non-existent to start with. So this is a method that will produce a lot of false positives for premarital promiscuity, which an omniscient god might have mentioned. On the other hand, it's only women who get victimized by a false positive -- nothing really to worry about, for a morally perfect god...

12-17-2002, 07:09 AM	#44
Born Free Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Scotland Posts: 4,177	I don't have a bible to hand to give you the verse no but I know that in the very first chapter he makes men and women and sends them "forth to multiply". In the second chapter he sees there is nobody to till the earth in his glorious garden so he makes adam then from him eve. This inconsistency right at the start made the alarm bells ring and they never stopped. How could this omni everything god forget he'd already made humans??? I'll get back later if you need verse nos.

12-17-2002, 09:15 AM	#46
Bumble Bee Tuna Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Middletown, CT Posts: 7,333	The Easter Challenge. There's just so much contradictory there to begin with. Then tack on that it's THE central story of Christianity, and it becomes quite humorous. I really haven't studied inconsistencies in great detail, however, so I'm sure there are more amusing ones out there. I do like that Exodus Horse/Cattle stuff... -B

12-17-2002, 01:38 PM	#47
AJ113 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Hull UK Posts: 854	Many thanks, each. Any more for any more?

12-17-2002, 01:58 PM	#48
CALDONIA Regular Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sunnyvale,CA Posts: 371	Well, as for Bible difficulties, even as a child I was skeptical about that whole Noah's Ark story. Even bad science fiction must have some plausibility. The tortured "explanations" of the physical possibility of the tale from creationists is simultaneously sad and laughable.

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