Hayden

The same can be said of many religions which are older than Christianity and are still practiced today. Therefore, by that reasoning they are more "true" than Christianity.

Bible Humper

I would say option "b", Santa is more likely.

Let's say for the sake of argument that magic is real, and so both Yahweh and Santa are possible beings.

Santa doesn't suffer from the paradox of omnipotence, the problem of evil, and many more absurdities that are inherent to an omnimax deity.

Santa lacks a holy text allegedly inspired by his omniscient, omnipotent self that is packed to the tits with mistakes, absurdities, etc. as well as numerous stories that have proven to be legend rather than history.

There is no suspicion that Santa's magic stories were "borrowed" from another religion because of a suspicious amount of parallels. Jesus suffers greatly from this regarding Mithras, among others.

The stories of Santa don't contradict his nature, unlike the "loving" Yahweh who orders atrocities.

Nothing in the Santa stories, taken literally or not, contradicts evolution, astronomy, etc.

Santa is far more likely than Yahweh based on what evidence there is for or against either one of them.

Ab_Normal

d) equally *un*likely that either exist. I have not found evidence to support the existence of either.

Philosoft

Is that right?

</strong>

Which, as you know, is not proof that the positive claim, "Santa does not exist" is true.

<strong> You might be on to something here, but it's probably not what you want to hear.

<strong> The "world" cannot possess intrinsic goodness or be joyful. These are emotions and value judgements made by humans about our experiences.

<strong> You do realize existential questions are often dead-ends?

<strong> Jebus, but you are strange. And arrogant for that matter. Maybe communism is "true." Maybe fascism. Lots of lives taken for those, too.

True, Santa hasn't to my knowledge been worshipped as the creator of the universe, but to claim there is no long standing religious tradition is ludicrous. Hence, your only distinction becomes the number of people killed in Santa's or God's name, I guess.

Bible Humper

Hey, maybe a few guys did die for Santa's sake back when he was a pagan deity.

Bible Humper

Actually, take a look at the christian Santa, he doesn't fly around on a sleigh but he can raise the dead instead!


He was believed to be the Bishop of Myra in Lycia (now Turkey). He is alleged to have attended the first council of Nicea; however, his name does not appear on lists of attending bishops. He is honored as a Patron Saint in Austria, Belgium, Germany, Greece, Italy, Netherlands, Russia, Sicily, and Switzerland. 2 He is also the patron saint of children and sailors. Many legends and miracles are attributed to him:

When he was an infant, his mother only nursed him on Wednesdays and Fridays; he fasted the remaining days.

He halted a storm at sea to save three drowning sailors.

During his lifetime, he adored children and often threw gifts anonymously into the windows of their homes.

His father left him a fortune which he used to help poor children.

He grabbed the sword of an executioner to save the life of a political prisoner.

He brought back to life several children who had been killed.


It's funny how the OP refers to the popular Santa derisively compared to Yahweh, but the christian's "real" Santa is probably even more ridiculous, LOL.

I wonder how the "bringing children back to life" story started, perhaps they caught the old saint in the nude, behind the lad and "performing the Heimlich maneuver".

[ August 29, 2002: Message edited by: Bible Humper/ SCoW ]</p>

Defiant Heretic

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[ August 29, 2002: Message edited by: Defiant Heretic ]</p>

Jobar

Hello SUTG, welcome to II.

Understand that unbelievers think that both of these probabilities are very very small! But in fact, I must agree with Bible Humper on this. Santa requires us to ignore fantastic claims of invisible activities, but the claims made for God are even more fantastic, to me personally. (Thank you for specifying the Christian God!) So, b.

Doubting Didymus

If long estabished histories are guarantees of truth, then wouldn't unbelievers outrank everyone else? After all, there have been unbelievers around for as long as all religion has.

Most religions, even ones from the far past, are obsessed with us. Wouldn't we then be the most long lived religious philosophy?

Jack the Bodiless

b) Santa is more likely, for the reasons already given by Bible Humper.

Furthermore, I think I have always believed this, even as a child, despite being raised as a Christian. Santa was important to me, whereas God was a distant irrelevance, like "the government". I lost belief in God a few years after I lost belief in Santa, so there was a brief period in which I believed that God existed and Santa did not: but only because that was what I'd been taught. During that period, I did not seriously evaluate the likelihood of God's existence: when I finally did (by age 10 or thereabouts) I became an atheist.