Kvalhion

Christoph, the universe has existed for billions of years. Think about the universe as a very, very, very long story. Think of human beings as a very small part of that extremely large, long story. Compare this to a standard book, where characters in the stories play a brief but important role. Perhaps the entire existence of a character in a story is to participate in the larger story for just one moment of their lives.

The same thing would apply to a movie. Think of all the thousands of extras that are in many movies that are not the "purpose" of the movie. Do those characters have any purpose at all? Obviously they have a small role in the larger picture. Does every character have to know the entire plot of the movie to have purpose?

Three words that you refuse to utter appear to be: "I don't know." Imagine that, you don't know the ultimate purpose of the universe! Simply because you do not know the entire plot to the billion year old story of the universe does not mean you are useless. Nor does it mean that you should seek to change the focus of the universe to yourself to make you feel more significant.

No doubt it makes you feel small and insignificant to think of yourself as just one person out of billions, in one instant of time out of billions, on one earth out of billions. Proclaiming yourself the focus of the entire universe changes nothing.

So what to do? Here is what I do. I admit I do not know the ultimate meaning of the incomprehensibly large universe. Furthermore, I realize that I likely cannot know and never will know. While I play my small, insignificant role, I choose other purposes to make my life meaningful to me and my family and friends. Just because this does not directly affect the entire universe does not make it meaningless. It's meaningful to me.

I hope you realize what you sound like when you bring up such a topic. It is equivalent to talking every extra in a movie and demanding, "How can you be in this movie if you are not the star? What is the point?!"

Jayhawker Soule

If you prefer a false answer to no answer, go with God.

Christoph

Atheism exposes itself when it tries to say that the evolutionary process continued without any kind of goal whatsoever.

To admit a goal is to imply pre-existing intelligence. However, if you believe evolution, there will be few things that you can't be convinced of (given the right motivation). Congratulations on your superior display of faith.

NOGO

A purpose is a goal.
Once you have achieved that goal what comes next?
What are you going to do for the rest of eternity?
You will be without a purpose.

In view of the above what is your purpose knowing that God exists?

Christoph

That's something you're going to have to figure out. I'm confident that you will sooner or later. I hope it's sooner.

Mageth

I haven't established that there is a Purpose. I wouldn't be presumptuous enough to think that I could do something like that when nature screams at the top of her lungs and has been for years.

Really? Then do you feel like your life is worthless and purposeless, as according to your logic you should?

I will never prove anything to you until you stop saying, "There is no God, therefore..." You must admit the possibility of the supernatural or you will continue to bang your head against a wall.

I was banging my head against the wall because you inist that we haven't answered your question, when the truth is you haven't accepted our repeated answers to your question.

Adding a god or the supernatural to the equation does not necessarily add Purpose to the universe. Read up on "deism," for example. You're really asking us to add the Judeo-christian god(I'm assuming you're christian). I'm strongly atheistic concerning the Judeo-christian god, so I say unequivocally "There is no Judeo-christian god." So accepting the possibility of the supernatural wouldn't gain your argument much leverage.

And give upon trying to "prove" anything, esp. if it requires accepting a supernatural explanation. You're paddling upstream using a teaspoon, and your boat's full of leaks.

Christoph

I know what my purpose here is. I don't know everything about it, but I know the main purpose. As far as the rest of eternity, I can't imagine what it will be like. Every indication is that it's going to be good. After all, if God knows me the way I know He does, He knows what I need and what I don't need for eternity.

Kvalhion

Congratulations on your continual display of ignorance.

You continually insist that your declaration of purpose is the one true purpose without being able to verify its validity whatsoever.

In your arrogance, you chalk up the entire existence of the universe to be all about you, and declare your purpose to rule it. This is simply human arrogance at its worst.

Why don't you try providing one shred of proof for the existence of your God before you lecture about how your invented purpose is better than anyone else's.

Christoph

Here's another thought. If you know without a doubt that there is no God (which is impossible to know for sure), then the answer is "we don't know the answer". If you admit that there can be a God, it's unreasonable not to think that He is the answer. It just depends on how much of a free-thinker you are. ...Whether or not you're "allowed" to believe what the evidence suggests.

NOGO

You have not answered my question.

What is that purpose with a God here if you don`t know about eternity?