Freethought & Rationalism Archive

theIPU · 04-14-2003, 01:21 PM

Someone asked me why I was against religion. I said it's done some bad things (spanish inquisition, etc.). They responded something along the lines of atheism has too. So if you could please give me a least of reasons to be against religion that would be helpful.

Walross · 04-14-2003, 01:32 PM

I'll give you one good reason that I think is the clincher for me: it promotes magical thinking while at the same time making people believe that critical thought is somehow "bad".

King Rat · 04-14-2003, 01:34 PM

I don't recall atheists ever burning anyone at the stake.

Undercurrent · 04-14-2003, 01:52 PM

The fundamental an obvious reason -- it's not true. There are no gods, sprits, demons, demiurges, djinn, or angels, and any ideology that says otherwise is false. The only way they would be belevable is if they convince me that I'm mistaken on that point, but they never even try to do that.

Imagine if I tried to convince you that there was a chocolate bar on my desk, not by showing you the chocolate bar, or taking a picture of the chocolate bar and sending it to you, but rather by telling you about how good people who believe there's a chocolate bar on my desk are compared to people who don't, or saying that there's chance that you'll be eternally damned if you don't believe in the chocolate bar, or go on about how I was born a chocolate-bar-believer and will die a chocolate-bar-believer. You'd think I'm daft.

mjennyt · 04-14-2003, 01:53 PM

Slight modification on my part.

I don't remember any atheists burning anyone at the stake in the name of atheism.

Otherwise you get Stalin thrown back at you.

Treacle Worshipper · 04-14-2003, 01:59 PM

It's untrue. Which means that it gives people a false basis for living. Which means that they are unlikely to make the best decisions for their lives. Which is bad, IMO.

Some types of religion try to discredit science. Science has done far more to improve our quality of life & fight disease than any or all religions. When people rely on, say, prayer for healing of serious illness, and don't apply modern medicine, they are likely to die. That's bad too.

I thought I would try to give some modern examples. You will probably be told that Stalin was an atheist, and AFAIK, he was. But Hitler was a Christian, and it's easy to play the blame game. Personally, I'd try not to get dragged into that tit-for-tat stuff, it just leaves everyone feeling annoyed & self-righteous

Hope some of this helps.
TW

King Rat · 04-14-2003, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Otherwise you get Stalin thrown back at you.

[bartsimpson]
Oh yeah...
[/bartsimpson]

Besides, I'm sure throwing Stalin would be quite a feat. By now he's probably a little crumbly.

Bumble Bee Tuna · 04-14-2003, 05:00 PM

Religion promotes irrational thought, and gives people an excuse not to think. It gets in the way of progress (stem cell research, etc) and freedom (abortion, anything sex-related, etc).

Oh yeah, and it's WRONG.

-B

theIPU · 04-14-2003, 05:27 PM

thanks for all your responses and I'll be sure to use them, however, I have on more question. If someone says "Why do you make so much fun/critique religion if you don't believe in it?" How would you respond?

beastmaster · 04-14-2003, 05:31 PM

Ain't nothing bad with religion.

I merely think god-belief is incorrect and unjustified.

But religion offers profound questions even if the supplied answers are wrong. And it's inspired brilliant acts of creative imagination. I think Zen Buddhism is a wonderful religion all-around, even though I don't practice it.

I'm an atheist, not an anti-theist.

04-14-2003, 01:21 PM	#1
theIPU Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Ohio Posts: 65	what's bad with religion? Someone asked me why I was against religion. I said it's done some bad things (spanish inquisition, etc.). They responded something along the lines of atheism has too. So if you could please give me a least of reasons to be against religion that would be helpful.

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04-14-2003, 01:32 PM	#2
Walross Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Edmonton, AB, Canada Posts: 1,569	I'll give you one good reason that I think is the clincher for me: it promotes magical thinking while at the same time making people believe that critical thought is somehow "bad".

04-14-2003, 01:34 PM	#3
King Rat Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 6,855	I don't recall atheists ever burning anyone at the stake.

04-14-2003, 01:52 PM	#4
Undercurrent Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Santa Fe, NM Posts: 2,362	The fundamental an obvious reason -- it's not true. There are no gods, sprits, demons, demiurges, djinn, or angels, and any ideology that says otherwise is false. The only way they would be belevable is if they convince me that I'm mistaken on that point, but they never even try to do that. Imagine if I tried to convince you that there was a chocolate bar on my desk, not by showing you the chocolate bar, or taking a picture of the chocolate bar and sending it to you, but rather by telling you about how good people who believe there's a chocolate bar on my desk are compared to people who don't, or saying that there's chance that you'll be eternally damned if you don't believe in the chocolate bar, or go on about how I was born a chocolate-bar-believer and will die a chocolate-bar-believer. You'd think I'm daft.

04-14-2003, 01:53 PM	#5
mjennyt Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 39	Slight modification on my part. I don't remember any atheists burning anyone at the stake in the name of atheism. Otherwise you get Stalin thrown back at you.

04-14-2003, 01:59 PM	#6
Treacle Worshipper Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Wales, UK Posts: 931	It's untrue. Which means that it gives people a false basis for living. Which means that they are unlikely to make the best decisions for their lives. Which is bad, IMO. Some types of religion try to discredit science. Science has done far more to improve our quality of life & fight disease than any or all religions. When people rely on, say, prayer for healing of serious illness, and don't apply modern medicine, they are likely to die. That's bad too. I thought I would try to give some modern examples. You will probably be told that Stalin was an atheist, and AFAIK, he was. But Hitler was a Christian, and it's easy to play the blame game. Personally, I'd try not to get dragged into that tit-for-tat stuff, it just leaves everyone feeling annoyed & self-righteous Hope some of this helps. TW

04-14-2003, 05:00 PM	#8
Bumble Bee Tuna Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Middletown, CT Posts: 7,333	Religion promotes irrational thought, and gives people an excuse not to think. It gets in the way of progress (stem cell research, etc) and freedom (abortion, anything sex-related, etc). Oh yeah, and it's WRONG. -B

04-14-2003, 05:27 PM	#9
theIPU Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Ohio Posts: 65	thanks for all your responses and I'll be sure to use them, however, I have on more question. If someone says "Why do you make so much fun/critique religion if you don't believe in it?" How would you respond?

04-14-2003, 05:31 PM	#10
beastmaster Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Madrid / I am a: Lifelong atheist Posts: 885	Ain't nothing bad with religion. I merely think god-belief is incorrect and unjustified. But religion offers profound questions even if the supplied answers are wrong. And it's inspired brilliant acts of creative imagination. I think Zen Buddhism is a wonderful religion all-around, even though I don't practice it. I'm an atheist, not an anti-theist.

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