beth

No, I honestly cannot imagine a situation where sex abuse would do no harm for a child. It is harmful to the child in every situation. You cannot dissuade me on this. When I asked my molester why, he said it was because he liked making little girls feel good. Now how f-cked up is that!

I cannot even stand the thought of the whole man-boy organization existing. I don't even see how you people can try to rationalize child molestation.

echidna

A question Fr.Andrew …

So is Renee’s “nurturing” of Mimi, contingent on sex ?

If so, I hardly see it as nurturing, it can only be self-interested exploitation. As Renee’s dependence on this relationship grows, so too does the pressure to maintain it, regardless of Mimi’s wishes.

Presumably as Mimi grows up, should the relationship grow as such, it will increasingly interfere with her own relationships & Mimi becomes more of a possession than a nurtured child, since for many years Renee will remain the dominant player. Mimi’s freedom to develop is likely to be curtailed by Renee.

Mimi is likely to learn to associate any form of nurturing, particularly parental, with sex. And there is a risk of growing up as one who would be unable to care for another child without thoughts of engaging in sex with that child. With such self-interest present and children so vulnerable, the opportunity for exploitation is inevitable. There is no guarantee the act will be without negative consequences. Naturally this is not inevitable, but the risk alone makes the act criminally irresponsible to say the least.

Similarly there are many other examples of problems stemming from people unable to separate the concepts of nurturing from sex. Indeed because the adult is invariably in the dominant position, many abused children grow up to retain this submissive attitude in sexual relationships & often fall back into abusive adult sexual relationships in later life. Do they all ? No. Does that then justify the risk ? Of course not.

If the nurturing is not contingent on sex, then she has no reason to pursue it since in doing so she places an irresponsible risk to Mimi's future.

Fr.Andrew and others seem to delight in endlessly raising this topic & I find it as vile as whether it’s OK to date rape schoolgirls with rohypnol, just because there are some rape victims who can actually rebuild their lives.

Personally I thoroughly disagree that paedophilia is the Last Great Bastion of the Sexual Revolution, just as I reject assault as a desirable expression of Free Will.

echidna

BTW I won't vote because the entire poll is misleadingly set up.
The category I would select would be :

It sometimes leaves minimal long-term harm, and is usually wrong. It is never right.

Fr.Andrew

(Fr Andrew): I found the thread As you can see, nothing material has been changed. Perhaps your memory is not quite what you think that it is?

Fr.Andrew

(echnida): So is Renee’s “nurturing” of Mimi, contingent on sex ?
(Fr Andrew): In my scenario, no.

(echnida): If the nurturing is not contingent on sex, then she has no reason to pursue it since in doing so she places an irresponsible risk to Mimi's future.
(Fr Andrew): She's not pursuing it. It just happens and she doesn't stop it.
With respect to Mimi's future--I agree that our culture lays a heavy burden on those who, even in innocence, step outside society's bounds. In essence, you seem to be saying that the harm to Mimi will come, not from sexual contact with an older person, but from the way that such contact is viewed by society and her (Mimi's) adjustment to that reality.
I agree.

Fr.Andrew

(Blondegoddess): It is harmful to the child in every situation.
(Fr Andrew): That's incorrect.

Fr.Andrew

(Fr Andrew): Thanks, Michael. What's a tiffin?

Fr.Andrew

(HelenM): "...I do not believe it's ever in the best interests of a child to have an adult using them for sexual gratification."
(Fr Andrew): I agree. But that's not what my scenario entailed.

Mad Kally

Maybe I wasn't focusing on all those peripheral details at the time. The relatives name and locations and all that. I shouldn't have brought it up. Does it really make a difference? NO! I'd better bow out of this while I still have time. Do you have any man/boy scenarios? If not, why not?


Kally

HelenM

What's the difference then, in the situations when the youngster is not harmed, since you can envisage it? Amount of physical pain? Number of times? What?

I'm sure there are lots of abusers (including blondegoddess's ) who claim their victims 'enjoyed' it. It's still abuse.

Helen