Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Bumble Bee Tuna · 10-31-2002, 07:00 PM

We all take for granted that the Christian God is omnipotent, omniscient, and perfect.
I assume that this doctrine is biblically correct, but what are the verses to support this belief? I've never actually heard or seen them. I don't know what forum this belongs in but it started bugging me.

-B

Keith Russell · 11-01-2002, 12:23 PM

Bumble Bee said:
"We all take for granted that the Christian God is omnipotent, omniscient, and perfect."

We do? (I mean, I don't.)

But, I've talked to enough Christians to know that (at least the ones to whom I've spoken) have a 'concept' of 'God' which describes 'God' as omnipotent, omniscienct, omnipresent, eternal, omnibenevolent, and perfect.

Keith.

Thomas Metcalf · 11-01-2002, 12:52 PM

Originally posted by Bumble Bee Tuna:

"I assume that this doctrine is biblically correct, but what are the verses to support this belief?"

The God of the Bible is indeed omnipotent (in a "can do all things" and "nothing is impossible" sense), omniscient (this includes knowing the future), and omnipresent.

For omnipotence, see Job 42:2 and Matthew 19:26.
For omniscience, see Hebrews 4:13, Isaiah 4:29 (for Divine foresight), and Daniel 2:2.
For omnipresence, see Jeremiah 23:24.

As for omnibenevolence, I have no idea. I'd say this notion is, so to speak, interpolated.

Bumble Bee Tuna · 11-01-2002, 03:58 PM

Heh, I should have known.

I suppose I should have added the addendum that We also take for granted that the Omnimax Christian God is also a compelte work of fiction.

Thomas, thanks for the verses, I'll check them out.

-B

Psycho Economist · 11-01-2002, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bumble Bee Tuna:
<strong>We all take for granted that the Christian God is omnipotent, omniscient, and perfect.</strong>

Yeah, it makes Christians feel good to say that, but studies show they don't really believe it: they can't get their mind around the concepts.

Check the book Religion Explained by Pascal Boyer (try your nearest college library). He reports a study (i don't know if he ran it or not), where Christians were asked multiple-choice and free-response questions about how God would affect some miracles. They overwhelmingly chose the most mundane possiblity.

Quote:

Paraphrase of an example used. Not an actual quote.

An iceberg has struck a passenger liner in the north Atlantic, the hull has been severely ruptured and the ship is flooding. How would God go about saving the passengers and crew?

<ol type="A">[*]Change the physical properties of the ocean or the ship to keep it afloat.[*]Alter the metabolisms of the passengers and crew so once in the water they will neither drown nor hypothermiate[*]God will direct the captain of another ship to change course and intercept the foundering liner.[/list=a]

Participants chose answer C.

(ooh... ordered lists!)

[ November 01, 2002: Message edited by: Psycho Economist ]</p>

Jobar · 11-01-2002, 06:36 PM

A good topic, BBT. Modding this forum, I have seen that every Christian- every theist- has their own individual definition of God. Ask the right questions, and you can prove that God is not exactly the same for any two believers.

I rather think this says more about the believers than it does about God.

10-31-2002, 07:00 PM	#1
Bumble Bee Tuna Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Middletown, CT Posts: 7,333	Omnimax God? We all take for granted that the Christian God is omnipotent, omniscient, and perfect. I assume that this doctrine is biblically correct, but what are the verses to support this belief? I've never actually heard or seen them. I don't know what forum this belongs in but it started bugging me. -B

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11-01-2002, 12:23 PM	#2
Keith Russell Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Overland Park, Kansas Posts: 1,336	Bumble Bee said: "We all take for granted that the Christian God is omnipotent, omniscient, and perfect." We do? (I mean, I don't.) But, I've talked to enough Christians to know that (at least the ones to whom I've spoken) have a 'concept' of 'God' which describes 'God' as omnipotent, omniscienct, omnipresent, eternal, omnibenevolent, and perfect. Keith.

11-01-2002, 12:52 PM	#3
Thomas Metcalf Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Boulder, CO Posts: 1,009	Originally posted by Bumble Bee Tuna: "I assume that this doctrine is biblically correct, but what are the verses to support this belief?" The God of the Bible is indeed omnipotent (in a "can do all things" and "nothing is impossible" sense), omniscient (this includes knowing the future), and omnipresent. For omnipotence, see Job 42:2 and Matthew 19:26. For omniscience, see Hebrews 4:13, Isaiah 4:29 (for Divine foresight), and Daniel 2:2. For omnipresence, see Jeremiah 23:24. As for omnibenevolence, I have no idea. I'd say this notion is, so to speak, interpolated.

11-01-2002, 03:58 PM	#4
Bumble Bee Tuna Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Middletown, CT Posts: 7,333	Heh, I should have known. I suppose I should have added the addendum that We also take for granted that the Omnimax Christian God is also a compelte work of fiction. Thomas, thanks for the verses, I'll check them out. -B

11-01-2002, 06:36 PM	#6
Jobar Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: secularcafe.org Posts: 9,525	A good topic, BBT. Modding this forum, I have seen that every Christian- every theist- has their own individual definition of God. Ask the right questions, and you can prove that God is not exactly the same for any two believers. I rather think this says more about the believers than it does about God.

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