Toto

<a href="http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20021007/ap_on_go_co/congress_pledge_4" target="_blank">Bill Reaffirms 'Under God' in Pledge</a>

Look up S. 2690 on <a href="http://thomas.loc.gov" target="_blank">http://thomas.loc.gov</a>

ebolamonger

That disgusts me. It's divisive and blatantly wrong.

I read through parts of the senate bill and it was incredibly nauseating:

WTF? And here I was thinking the Constitution and Bill of Rights actually meant something...
What is with this Northwest Ordinance??

-nikki-

Philosoft

And why is it being trotted out now as if it supercedes or subsumes the 1st Amendment? If there was ever a more cut-and-dried case of blatantly politicizing a non-political issue, I haven't seen it.

galiel

The Bill is unconstitutional and won't survive a legal challenge.

Toto

<a href="http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=59&t=000547&p=" target="_blank">previous thread on this bill</a>, with link to Buffman's research on the bogus history incorporated with the bill.

RufusAtticus

Didn't they all ready pass the exact same bill a few months ago? Why the rush to do it again? Oh yeah, november is comming. Politicains suck ass. <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

Buffman

Toto

Thank you!

<img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

4th Generation Atheist

Here's the simple fact.

We can pull out all the precedent we want, all the rulings we want, all the laws we want up to and including the First Amendment.

But it doesn't matter. They are the majority and we live in their country. If they want us all to say undergod, then we'll have to say it. The Xns have taken over, have always been the majority and are now in the process of saying "fuck church and state, we want a Xn country". We can't stop them. We lose. End of story.

lisarea

Apparently not. Stupidity has really got some momentum going.

Now, I don't have a problem with stupidity in and of itself. Lack of intellectual ability is not a character flaw. Even willful ignorance is OK as far as I'm concerned. If politics bore you, if you don't really concern yourself with learning about current events, fine.

But keep your fucking mouth shut. Don't vote, don't write letters to the editor to your representatives. Don't try to influence public opinion with your ignorance. That is morally wrong, and dangerous to boot.

We certainly can't force them to really think about these issues or consider them logically and even-handedly when they're running around blathering about things they don't understand. But, you know, maybe we can give them their stupid rope, sit back, and watch them hang themselves with it.

Yep. But once this sort of thing gains momentum, 'we' will expand to the point that it includes the whole damned country.

And if I can't change that, I can at least sit back and laugh when it happens.

Not necessarily.

And this is why ignorant people shouldn't try to influence public opinion. The separation clause isn't just protection for the state, but for the church as well. Of course, they're too lazy and ignorant to really think this stuff through to its logical conclusion.

So, fine. Let them have their fucking theocracy. Sure, they're happy now that they've managed to throw me out of their juggernaut mob rule government. I'm pretty much used to the whole taxation without representation thing.

But now what? Now that they've kicked out us atheists and pantheists? Next, they'll disenfranchise the non-Christian monotheists. Who really cares what a bunch of Jews and towelheads think, anyway, right? This is a Christian country. Um. Wait. To put a finer point on it, this is a Protestant country. Catholics and Mormons aren't real Americans, either. Wait! Wait! QUAKERS are Protestants? Those hippy librull freaks? Um, we meant this is a Baptist country. Yeah, Baptist. That's it! Well, you know, except for those weird Baptists.

So, say you get lucky. Say your little sect wins. SCORE, right? Well, the prize for said winners is a state-controlled church. Sure, your church will influence the state, but the state's going to influence your church, too. Don't like the laws? Tough shit. Biblical-based legislation will only go so far before the state will start putting restrictions on your beliefs in the interests of self-preservation.

And I'll be first in line to say "I told you so" and to tramp the dirt down on your stupid dead religion.

(Some days, I think I need to wear a little yellow sign that says: "WARNING! Stay back 200 feet! Not responsible for stabbin'!")

Krieger

Just another 401 hate-filled reactionaries...