isaac42

I seem to recall that, somewhere in the Bible, it says that God created evil. For the life of me, though, I can't find it!

Can anyone help?

isaac42

Found it! Isaiah 45:7. KJV, KJV21, ASV, YLT and Darby. Other translations skirt the issue by translating evil as calamity or somesuch.

offa

offa; from King James,


ISA 45:5 I am the LORD, and there is none else,
there is no God beside me: I girded
thee, though thou hast not known me:

ISA 45:6 That they may know from the rising
of the sun, and from the west, that
there is none beside me. I am the
LORD, and there is none else.

ISA 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness:
I make peace, and create evil: I the
LORD do all these things.

Vinnie

Skirt the issue? LOL

We had a thread on this subject before. One of the views was that on the basis of exegesis alone its not really possible to fully know what exactly is meant as translating ancient Hebrew is no walk in the park.

Glenn Miller has put together a nice paper though:

<a href="http://www.christian-thinktank.com/iamwrong1.html" target="_blank">http://www.christian-thinktank.com/iamwrong1.html</a>

Vinnie

By the way, if you look in the dictionary calamity is a definition of evil. They mean the same things. Apologists like myself will discern between types of evil though. If you wanted to say God has created evil on numerous occasions and you mean "destruction" or "calamity" by it I doubt many Bible believers will disagree with you. If you wish to say God ccreated moral ethical evil you will run into a problem. First such a statement is not too intelligent within the Christian framework as moral-ethical evils are free will choices. Ergo, moral-ethical evil CANNOT be "created". Moral-ethical evil is "performed" by definition. To say God created moral-ethical evil is idiotic in that light.

Vinnie

Sojourner553

Huh? Then who created the devil? Who created "moral-ethical evil"?

Or is God not all powerful according according to your individual view (not to be confused with generally accepted dogmas/creeds).

Sojourner

[ October 12, 2002: Message edited by: Sojourner553 ]</p>

Vinnie

Moral-ethical evil cannot be "created". It is performed as it is not a thing or being like an atom or star. Its a description or definition of a free will action that is not in conformity with God's will.

God. The devil, if you believe in such a being, is not evil ontologically. Originally the devil was an angel of light, again, if you believe such a story.

Omnipotence does not mean "capable of doing anything." If that is what you mean then I would say God is not omnipotent in that sense. Mopst Christians should as well as the Bible puts limits on God (e.g. it says He can't lie). Now the reason God can't lie is not due to some outside force or external nature. It is God's nature itself that does not permit lying in the Christian view.

I, like Greg Boyd, am content to say that, in the beginning God had all the power.

Vinnie

Emmanuel Goldstein

1 Kings 22:23: "Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in
the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil concerning
thee."

What about that?

Butters

As usual, We start off with "God created everything", but when "everything" is shown to be not all good, somehow this is not Gods fault, it is the fault of his creations, even though he created them the way they were.

If the pot cannot complain to the potter about how he was fashioned, can the potter complain to the pot about how it is fashioned?

If God has a plan, and Evil cannot thwart Gods plan, then any Evil done, must be part of Gods plan.

Amos

Before you blame God for creating evil you should first find out what the difference is between God and Lord God and then soon you will discover that God is not part of evil.