Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Valentine Pontifex · 07-28-2002, 07:23 PM

That Philip Johnson denies that HIV causes AIDS is rather well known. But Philip Johnson is not the HIV denier among the evolution deniers....

Tom Bethel is one as well as a relativity denier.

<a href="http://www.whale.to/c/null.html" target="_blank">TB denies HIV causes AIDS</a>
<a href="http://web.archive.org/web/20010619053950/http://www.spectator.org/archives/9904TAS/bethell9904.htm" target="_blank">TB denies relativity</a>

Jonathan Wells is an HIV denier:

<a href="http://www.virusmyth.net/aids/group.htm" target="_blank">Click here and search for his name</a>

This is all part of a larger pattern. Evolution deniers don't limit their nonsense to evolution.

Albion · 07-28-2002, 07:36 PM

They really do have something against science, don't they?

Camaban · 07-28-2002, 08:42 PM

just got to wonder why they'd have so much against research into finding out how to cure/prevent Aids spreading.

fando · 07-28-2002, 10:25 PM

It would be amusing to hear their response to the following proposal: Infect yourself with HIV. If it doesn't cause AIDS, as you firmly believe, then what's to fear?

Camaban · 07-28-2002, 11:44 PM

fando: I remember seeing someone do it on TV about 10 years ago.

can't remember the end result though.

anyone here know what I'm talking about? (I saw it when I was 8, so my memories aren't completely clear)

Albion · 07-28-2002, 11:47 PM

Yes, I have a vague recollection too. Wasn't it Peter Duesberg?

Of course, since HIV is very fragile once it's outside the human body, if he carried the stuff to the TV studio in a vial at room temperature and it sat around under the hot lights for a while and he injected himself half a day after the sample had been removed from whatever it was growing in, he'd have just given himself a dose of dead virus anyway.

Camaban · 07-29-2002, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Of course, since HIV is very fragile once it's outside the human body, if he carried the stuff to the TV studio in a vial at room temperature and it sat around under the hot lights for a while and he injected himself half a day after the sample had been removed from whatever it was growing in, he'd have just given himself a dose of dead virus anyway.

hmm, honest test, making something look good, honest test, making something look good.....

Which would you choose?

Albion · 07-29-2002, 01:21 AM

Well, I might just be being cynical because I honestly don't remember what condition that virus was in; he could have specified that it had been kept under conditions where it'd be live. But then again, he might not have. I wonder if there's any info on Google; maybe I'll have a trawl later but it's way past bedtime now.

Camaban · 07-29-2002, 01:50 AM

from a site I found when I looked up him

Quote:

Duesberg contends that the immune system of AIDS victims collapses because of the destructive effects of excessive sex and illicit drugs

oh, ho....

Denshuu · 07-29-2002, 04:39 AM

Quote:

Duesberg contends that the immune system of AIDS victims collapses because of the destructive effects of excessive sex and illicit drugs

That must make rabbits about 10 times more dangerously diseased than that monkey from 'Outbreak'.

07-28-2002, 07:23 PM	#1
Valentine Pontifex Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Orion Arm of the Milky Way Galaxy Posts: 3,092	HIV denial and Creationism That Philip Johnson denies that HIV causes AIDS is rather well known. But Philip Johnson is not the HIV denier among the evolution deniers.... Tom Bethel is one as well as a relativity denier. <a href="http://www.whale.to/c/null.html" target="_blank">TB denies HIV causes AIDS</a> <a href="http://web.archive.org/web/20010619053950/http://www.spectator.org/archives/9904TAS/bethell9904.htm" target="_blank">TB denies relativity</a> Jonathan Wells is an HIV denier: <a href="http://www.virusmyth.net/aids/group.htm" target="_blank">Click here and search for his name</a> This is all part of a larger pattern. Evolution deniers don't limit their nonsense to evolution.

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07-28-2002, 07:36 PM	#2
Albion Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: US east coast. And www.theroyalforums.com Posts: 2,829	They really do have something against science, don't they?

07-28-2002, 08:42 PM	#3
Camaban Regular Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 473	just got to wonder why they'd have so much against research into finding out how to cure/prevent Aids spreading.

07-28-2002, 10:25 PM	#4
fando Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Los Angeles Area Posts: 1,372	It would be amusing to hear their response to the following proposal: Infect yourself with HIV. If it doesn't cause AIDS, as you firmly believe, then what's to fear?

07-28-2002, 11:44 PM	#5
Camaban Regular Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 473	fando: I remember seeing someone do it on TV about 10 years ago. can't remember the end result though. anyone here know what I'm talking about? (I saw it when I was 8, so my memories aren't completely clear)

07-28-2002, 11:47 PM	#6
Albion Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: US east coast. And www.theroyalforums.com Posts: 2,829	Yes, I have a vague recollection too. Wasn't it Peter Duesberg? Of course, since HIV is very fragile once it's outside the human body, if he carried the stuff to the TV studio in a vial at room temperature and it sat around under the hot lights for a while and he injected himself half a day after the sample had been removed from whatever it was growing in, he'd have just given himself a dose of dead virus anyway.

07-29-2002, 01:21 AM	#8
Albion Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: US east coast. And www.theroyalforums.com Posts: 2,829	Well, I might just be being cynical because I honestly don't remember what condition that virus was in; he could have specified that it had been kept under conditions where it'd be live. But then again, he might not have. I wonder if there's any info on Google; maybe I'll have a trawl later but it's way past bedtime now.

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