Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Harumi · 10-31-2002, 07:39 AM

I just want to know what's original reason for Halloween.

Today my fundie friend (I'm so pissed at him right now that if I was less than decent, I would have strangled that head of his until his deep voice squeaked and his head popped off!) told us that Halloween was a sacriledge against God, as the holiday wasn't Christian, and in fact, encouraged devil worship.

Apparently the old druids used this night to call upon the evil spirits to kill people.

I told the guy that that might be what it was before, but now it's a time for people to be what they aren't, hang out together, come together to share candy, and have fun.

He asked us why anyone would want to be what they aren't (considering the fact that this guy is an actor, I found that fairly hypocritical). Then he said that he didn't want to hang out with people. He prefered isolation (which is why he came to talk to us apparently

) and he didn't like fun.

A hypocrite and an idiot to the core, this guy truly ruined my Halloween and now I want to kick his fundie ass from here to whatever heaven he hopes to be in.

Sorry for the rant.

Duvenoy · 10-31-2002, 07:58 AM

Lighten up, bro. Never let an idiot spoil your good times. You'll end up with an ulcer with the size and ferocity of an angry snapping turtle.

I'm not entirely sure of this, but I think that it was indeed a Druid celebration called All Hallows Eve. As I recall from some long-ago reading, All Hallows Eve simply celebrated the last of the gathering of the crops, a giving of thanks to various spirits for the success, and a major party. Exactly how it got twisted into a time for juvenile extortionists to exact tribute the rest of us, I dunno.

doov

Captain Pedantic · 10-31-2002, 08:06 AM

I am aware that the date is the pagan new year, and is also (from a pagan point of view) a time when spirits can pass between their world and this one.

The traditions and rituals (including the dressing up, no doubt) probably stem from an attempt to keep the spirits under control.

Nowadays, of course, it's the perfect chance for miseryguts the world over to sabotage small childrens' chances at tooth decay by putting religious tracts (apparently designed for the slightly mentally subnormal) in their bags when all they wanted was something made entirely of glucose.

This is why their houses get covered in egg, and they have the cheek to blame Satan when they could have just got in a family pack of mini Mars Bars and doled them out.

Also, I've seen a lot of pumpkins and turnips (for the less well off) with faces cut out, I've seen a lot of witch costumes (not to mention mummy and vampire costumes) and I've seen fireworks and various other sorts of celebrations around this time of year (due, in part, to Guy Fawkes night) - but I've never seen any devil worship. It's just a laugh.

Abacus · 10-31-2002, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Harumi:
<strong>Today my fundie friend (I'm so pissed at him right now that if I was less than decent, I would have strangled that head of his until his deep voice squeaked and his head popped off!) told us that Halloween was a sacriledge against God, as the holiday wasn't Christian, and in fact, encouraged devil worship.
</strong>

I could be mistaken, but weren't Christmas and Easter originally pagan holidays? If so, what would he think of that?

Duvenoy · 10-31-2002, 08:20 AM

Quote:

I could be mistaken, but weren't Christmas and Easter originally pagan holidays? If so, what would he think of that?

Yes indeed.

Christanity has been ever the chamelion, adopting 'pagan' celebrations into it's own philophsy; the better to convert the heathen. It seems to have worked pretty well.

doov

simian · 10-31-2002, 08:24 AM

Don't forget that "All Saints Day" is Nov. 1. Of course that has nothing to do with placing a Christian holiday on top of a pagan one.

Simian

Pitshade · 10-31-2002, 08:41 AM

While it is sort of a rant, there is potential for discussion here.

Off to Misc. Religion

Bree · 10-31-2002, 08:45 AM

Wow, what a dumbass.

At any rate - if I recall correctly from my own pagan days, All Hallow's Eve is the night when spirits supposedly walk the earth, looking for people to haunt. The living dress up in masks to "hide" from any angry spirit that is seeking them out. For god measure, they put out candy to please the spirits into leaving them alone.

HelenM · 10-31-2002, 08:45 AM

Fwiw:

<a href="http://www.salon.com/books/feature/2002/10/28/halloween/?x" target="_blank">Despite the fact that conservative Christians in America have protested the "pagan" revelry of Halloween, the holiday owes its name and many of its trappings to Christianity.</a>

Helen

HaysooChreesto! · 10-31-2002, 10:14 AM

If it was possbile to channel spirits or put demons to work for us, wouldn't everyone be doing it? Who wouldn't want their own personal djinn, ghost, or whathaveyou to do their bidding?
The belief is so damn silly. My mother in law was apoplectic last year when my 11 year old daughter wanted to dress up as a witch and so my kid went as something else.

10-31-2002, 07:39 AM	#1
Harumi Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: N/A Posts: 3,184	Halloween is worshipping the devil! I just want to know what's original reason for Halloween. Today my fundie friend (I'm so pissed at him right now that if I was less than decent, I would have strangled that head of his until his deep voice squeaked and his head popped off!) told us that Halloween was a sacriledge against God, as the holiday wasn't Christian, and in fact, encouraged devil worship. Apparently the old druids used this night to call upon the evil spirits to kill people. I told the guy that that might be what it was before, but now it's a time for people to be what they aren't, hang out together, come together to share candy, and have fun. He asked us why anyone would want to be what they aren't (considering the fact that this guy is an actor, I found that fairly hypocritical). Then he said that he didn't want to hang out with people. He prefered isolation (which is why he came to talk to us apparently ) and he didn't like fun. A hypocrite and an idiot to the core, this guy truly ruined my Halloween and now I want to kick his fundie ass from here to whatever heaven he hopes to be in. Sorry for the rant.

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10-31-2002, 07:58 AM	#2
Duvenoy Veteran Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Just another hick from the sticks. Posts: 1,108	Lighten up, bro. Never let an idiot spoil your good times. You'll end up with an ulcer with the size and ferocity of an angry snapping turtle. I'm not entirely sure of this, but I think that it was indeed a Druid celebration called All Hallows Eve. As I recall from some long-ago reading, All Hallows Eve simply celebrated the last of the gathering of the crops, a giving of thanks to various spirits for the success, and a major party. Exactly how it got twisted into a time for juvenile extortionists to exact tribute the rest of us, I dunno. doov

10-31-2002, 08:06 AM	#3
Captain Pedantic Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: UK. Posts: 588	I am aware that the date is the pagan new year, and is also (from a pagan point of view) a time when spirits can pass between their world and this one. The traditions and rituals (including the dressing up, no doubt) probably stem from an attempt to keep the spirits under control. Nowadays, of course, it's the perfect chance for miseryguts the world over to sabotage small childrens' chances at tooth decay by putting religious tracts (apparently designed for the slightly mentally subnormal) in their bags when all they wanted was something made entirely of glucose. This is why their houses get covered in egg, and they have the cheek to blame Satan when they could have just got in a family pack of mini Mars Bars and doled them out. Also, I've seen a lot of pumpkins and turnips (for the less well off) with faces cut out, I've seen a lot of witch costumes (not to mention mummy and vampire costumes) and I've seen fireworks and various other sorts of celebrations around this time of year (due, in part, to Guy Fawkes night) - but I've never seen any devil worship. It's just a laugh.

10-31-2002, 08:24 AM	#6
simian Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: St. Louis, MO area Posts: 1,924	Don't forget that "All Saints Day" is Nov. 1. Of course that has nothing to do with placing a Christian holiday on top of a pagan one. Simian

10-31-2002, 08:41 AM	#7
Pitshade Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Sugar Grove,NC Posts: 4,316	While it is sort of a rant, there is potential for discussion here. Off to Misc. Religion

10-31-2002, 08:45 AM	#8
Bree Veteran Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Twin Cities, USA Posts: 3,197	Wow, what a dumbass. At any rate - if I recall correctly from my own pagan days, All Hallow's Eve is the night when spirits supposedly walk the earth, looking for people to haunt. The living dress up in masks to "hide" from any angry spirit that is seeking them out. For god measure, they put out candy to please the spirits into leaving them alone.

10-31-2002, 08:45 AM	#9
HelenM Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Ill Posts: 6,577	Fwiw: <a href="http://www.salon.com/books/feature/2002/10/28/halloween/?x" target="_blank">Despite the fact that conservative Christians in America have protested the "pagan" revelry of Halloween, the holiday owes its name and many of its trappings to Christianity.</a> Helen

10-31-2002, 10:14 AM	#10
HaysooChreesto! Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: SoCal USA Posts: 7,737	If it was possbile to channel spirits or put demons to work for us, wouldn't everyone be doing it? Who wouldn't want their own personal djinn, ghost, or whathaveyou to do their bidding? The belief is so damn silly. My mother in law was apoplectic last year when my 11 year old daughter wanted to dress up as a witch and so my kid went as something else.

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