Darth Dane

BS. Your god supposedly has done so, quite often, in the past. Remember when your god fed the masses? Cured the blind? What about inflicting his will on the Pharisee's? Do I dare even touch the OT, or has this rediculous bit of apolegetics been beaten badly enough?

Did I say that "My God" did those things in the OT?

Those who were cured wanted to be cured, and since Jesus could it was done.

Almost as rediculous. This non-sequitur conveniently leaves out the eternity spend in your room (without desert) if you don't love your mother.

My Mother wouldn't do that. My Mother Loves me so much so even if I don't Love back, she just smiles and says "Kids, what can you do?", until she knows you can take reasonable care of yourself , you're off to go where you will, but the door is always open and all ways lead home.

Your house could get washed away in a flood, faulty wiring can cause a fire and burn you alive. It is impossible to avoid the possibility of being hurt.

Think life is unfair?

You are free to do as you wish, and so even suicide :banghead: is a possibility.



People who strive to live healthy, stress-free lives get cancer every day.

Of course :notworthy

There is a double standard in your reasoning. You lay the blame on humanity for choosing not to interfere with people starving to death yet you consider God blameless for choosing not to interfere with people starving to death.

Do as I say, not as I do? Example by hypocrisy?


Well according to some, God did show us how to act towards eachother. All the way to death there was Love

One of my children is starving while my other child has food to spare. I would be an unfit parent if I didn't do everything within my power to feed my starving child.

So you would share I assume?

It is enough if they are pleased.

:notworthy

The need for protection is a flaw in the design.

If re-incarnation is true, would that be a safety net?

Would it matter so much to feel pain if you knew you will re-incarnate, at your own will so to say, that pain is just passing, so you can get a more intense experience of the good things while here on the physical plane?

As you will probably note, we can't know if there is such a net, not in a normal scientific way anyways.


Sounds good though, sounds like a Loving God, that allows us to trick ourselves into forgetting almost everything, live and have a life full of wonder, experiencing both the good and bad through many lives.




Waddya think, fairytale?






DD - Love & Laughter

Amaranth

I didn't list anything in the OT. It should go without having to be mentioned that it is an irreconcilable story to your assertions about god and free will. "Should" being the operative word, as I have no doubt I'm going to have to draw a very clear picture in order for you to see the simple form.

And god is omnipotent. Ergo, god can still cure the sick and feed the hungry. Are you now going to tell me that starving Etheopians don't want food, or that people dying of AIDS don't want to be cured? Oh, and you seem to have skipped the part about bullying other people into obeying. Just an oversight, right?

And now it's gone from non-sequitur to extended non-sequitur. Good job.

Yeah - Especially that part with the bull-whip. That was just god getting hot and heavy with a little S&M type love, right?


Amaranth

mike_decock

It certainly is. I'm very lucky and I wish everyone else was at least as fortunate as myself.

Almost every religious and ethical system has a similar code of reciprocity. This would be unnecessary if the design wasn't flawed to begin with.

I would share, create more, eliminate the need for food. There are many options for a better design.

If it were certain, it would eliminate some of the angst of being aware of our own mortality. Since it's unproven, it's best to assume that it's just wishful thinking and enjoy the life you know you have.

That depends on what happens after we are reincarnated. Do we return to this physical plane or one which also includes pain? If we transcend this one to one where we cannot sense pain, what is the point of this one at all?

-Mike...

Darth Dane

I'll retract some of my words. If you see a faulty design, it is faulty, only your own eyes can change that.

That depends on what happens after we are reincarnated. Do we return to this physical plane or one which also includes pain? If we transcend this one to one where we cannot sense pain, what is the point of this one at all?

The point is on the physical plane, we can experience feeklings more intensely. "In Heaven" all is good, but soon it becomes standard, just as your mood is now perhaps. Not up not down, just even. As crazy as this sounds we do this recycling because it is fun, instead of living forever in one place, we get to try out many places during our many lives, and because of this everyone forgives everyone as we realize that we are all on the same team so to speak.
It's like we have one Life full of lives.

Of course if you can't see this, or believe in it, I can't show it to you I can't tell you how the apple tastes you have to take one youself.

Yeah - Especially that part with the bull-whip. That was just god getting hot and heavy with a little S&M type love, right?


Bullwhip?


Amaranth that above answer is also valid to your questions.

Of course people take away others freewill, some give it up freely, just like when we vote.


We have all tried everything in past lives. Being kings and peasants, the "sinner" and "saint", rich and poor, big and small.







DD - Love & Laughter

mike_decock

My moods fluctuate between even and up. No down is necessary to feel intensely good. You don't need to get kicked in the teeth before you can be thrilled by a kiss.

-Mike...

Darth Dane

Lets say in your world, perfect world, that there is no "bad" thing.

Lets say right now, you are 1 unit happy. If you become 2 units happy, lets say you ate chocolate and that made you happy. If you at any point revert to 1 unit of happiness, you are effectively becoming less happy or your happyness has taken a negative turn, you are still happy, 1 unit, but you could have been more happy. This is a negative thing a bad thing, it is "painful" to go from 10 units of happy back to just one, it will seem as if things suck big time.

In a world of no pain or bad things, we could only get more and more happy, we wouldn't know what it is to feel less happy than we just were only more.

See where I Am going?






DD - Love & Laughter

mike_decock

Yes. You're just shifting the definition of "painful" to a decrease in happiness. In a world of no pain or bad things, we could move among different levels of happiness. No pain is necessary to accomplish this.

-Mike...

Darth Dane

Our perception of "pain" in this reality could change. Those who like s&m like what you call "pain" to them it is pleasure. On the same scale we have pleasure and pain.

Everything is a point on a scale, subject to change and control


So now we've entered into the zone of relativity. Depending on how you look at things, you will see a certain thing as either good or bad. Others sometimes have a reversal of what is good and bad, from your POV! Do you know for sure if yours IS teh correct one?

You can learn to like pain if you want, to find pleasure where you thought only pain existed.


So "God" has allowed everything and anything to find pleasure as they see fit. Depending on where they are on the scale, they will find different things to find pleasure in, even to a seeming contradiction what someone on another point on teh scale sees that thing as bad.

Yin/yang seems very intertwined into eachother.



No pain no gain, isn't that a slogan for muscle men?




DD - Love & Laughter

scombrid

Do you comprehend eternity? If you’re in heaven forever, then this finite period that is meant to add spice (your assertion) to eternal life is infinitesimally small in comparison. From the frame of reference of eternal boredom (eternal even-ness) that is heaven, this short bit of finite time that is physical reality doesn’t even exist.

Taffer

Oh, Gawd. I feel so damn nerdy for getting that reference. Somebody please tell me I'm not alone.

As for the original question, yes. Assuming we're talking about the Christian god here and that he'd let me into heaven, I'd probably feel pretty miserable for the first few millenia and pretty bored for the rest of eternity, but I figure it'd be better than hell. I'm selfish like that.