Freethought & Rationalism Archive

beth · 08-04-2003, 01:48 PM

I just went to open house today. I got to meet my kids new teachers and we went to visit the teachers from last year. The problem is, my son's old teacher has a sign over her door that reads,"In God We Trust". Now I really am not making too much of a fuss and she is a great teacher, but I am seeing more and more of that stuff all over the school. Last year the PTA programs had reverent themes during the patriotic holidays. I am just wondering if this is legal. My children attend public school.

beth · 08-04-2003, 02:03 PM

I should add that alot of the PTA programs that have reverent themes, including mentioning God, are held during school hours.

Ronin · 08-04-2003, 02:06 PM

It became law last year in MS to display those posters in a conspicuous area throughout the school and in classrooms.

I asked a certain master photoshopper from this very board to amend a similar version of the poster to read ~ "In Gods Some Trust". I enlarged it and printed it...and posted it conspicuously on the wall of my office at the police department and gave one to my kids...they laugh and smile at the ones in school now...dirty heathens.

God(s)ess(es)...LOL

StrictSeparationist · 08-04-2003, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by beth
I should add that alot of the PTA programs that have reverent themes, including mentioning God, are held during school hours.

Although the simple posting of the phrase "In God We Trust" is probably defensible under the infinitely disingenuous "ceremonial deism" doctrine, I would say that it is possible that these PTA programs you define fall under the direct proscription of McCollum v. Board of Education, 333 U.S. 203 (1948). It all depends on the exact content of the assemblies, and to what extent a court could construe them to be manifesting a religious viewpoint. However, if the content of the programs is established, then the rest is academic, since they take place during school time, (presumably) are held on school property, and (presumably) are mandatory for students to attend. You would have to describe the exact nature of the PTA programs in more detail for anyone to give a definite answer, but I would say that if you feel strongly about this you should consider contacting your state ACLU affiliate. Often, a letter from a group like the ACLU will cause a school to back down without anyone having to go through costly and time-consuming litigation. Good luck on solving this.

beth · 08-06-2003, 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by StrictSeparationist
Although the simple posting of the phrase "In God We Trust" is probably defensible under the infinitely disingenuous "ceremonial deism" doctrine, I would say that it is possible that these PTA programs you define fall under the direct proscription of McCollum v. Board of Education, 333 U.S. 203 (1948). It all depends on the exact content of the assemblies, and to what extent a court could construe them to be manifesting a religious viewpoint. However, if the content of the programs is established, then the rest is academic, since they take place during school time, (presumably) are held on school property, and (presumably) are mandatory for students to attend. You would have to describe the exact nature of the PTA programs in more detail for anyone to give a definite answer, but I would say that if you feel strongly about this you should consider contacting your state ACLU affiliate. Often, a letter from a group like the ACLU will cause a school to back down without anyone having to go through costly and time-consuming litigation. Good luck on solving this.

Thank you.

James Hamlin · 08-07-2003, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ronin
God(s)ess(es)...LOL

A slight amendment to your new motto:
In (no) (G/g)od(s)ess(es) we trust.

yelyos · 08-07-2003, 03:11 PM

Wouldnt it be "In (G/g)od(s)(ess(es)) (we/I) trust." ?

James Hamlin · 08-07-2003, 03:47 PM

It's an iterative process. Yes, I suppose that's about right, except that you left out the "(no)".

08-04-2003, 01:48 PM	#1
beth Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: where orange blossoms bloom... Posts: 1,802	In God We Trust. I just went to open house today. I got to meet my kids new teachers and we went to visit the teachers from last year. The problem is, my son's old teacher has a sign over her door that reads,"In God We Trust". Now I really am not making too much of a fuss and she is a great teacher, but I am seeing more and more of that stuff all over the school. Last year the PTA programs had reverent themes during the patriotic holidays. I am just wondering if this is legal. My children attend public school.

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08-04-2003, 02:03 PM	#2
beth Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: where orange blossoms bloom... Posts: 1,802	I should add that alot of the PTA programs that have reverent themes, including mentioning God, are held during school hours.

08-04-2003, 02:06 PM	#3
Ronin Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Mississippi Posts: 5,047	It became law last year in MS to display those posters in a conspicuous area throughout the school and in classrooms. I asked a certain master photoshopper from this very board to amend a similar version of the poster to read ~ "In Gods Some Trust". I enlarged it and printed it...and posted it conspicuously on the wall of my office at the police department and gave one to my kids...they laugh and smile at the ones in school now...dirty heathens. God(s)ess(es)...LOL

08-07-2003, 03:11 PM	#7
yelyos Regular Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: northern suburbs of Toronto, Canada Posts: 401	Wouldnt it be "In (G/g)od(s)(ess(es)) (we/I) trust." ?

08-07-2003, 03:47 PM	#8
James Hamlin Regular Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: USA Posts: 155	It's an iterative process. Yes, I suppose that's about right, except that you left out the "(no)".

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