Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Jayhawker Soule · 01-28-2002, 09:28 AM

I would appreciate some help in understanding the noncognitivist position as discussed in <a href="http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/theodore_drange/definition.html" target="_blank"> Atheism, Agnosticism, Noncognitivism (1998) by Theodore M. Drange</a>

For example, Drange writes:

Quote:

Among the types which may be distinguished are the following:

Unknowability agnostics, who say that not only is there no evidence relevant to the issue of God's existence but that there could be none. They may view the issue as so abstract and removed from human experience that it is impossible that we should have any evidence regarding it, one way or the other, so the matter is essentially unknowable. (Note that people with this outlook could easily move over to the position of noncognitivism. They are making the claim that the matter of God's existence is essentially unknowable and that there could not possibly be evidence regarding it, one way or the other. If they were to conclude that the sentence "God exists" therefore does not express any proposition at all, then they would be noncognitivists. But if, instead, they allow that there is a proposition expressed but it is simply one that we cannot ever legitimately claim to be true or false, then they are to be classified as "unknowability agnostics." [emphasis added]

Given the statement "X exists", what is the criteria for asserting that this statement is or is not a proposition?

Theophage · 01-28-2002, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ReasonableDoubt:

Given the statement "X exists", what is the criteria for asserting that this statement is or is not a proposition?

I would assume that it would not be a proposition if X is ill-defined, meaningless, or incoherent.

Is "greplniflns exist" a proposition?

Jayhawker Soule · 01-28-2002, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Theophage:


I would assume that it would not be a proposition if X is ill-defined, meaningless, or incoherent.

Is "greplniflns exist" a proposition?

I guess I assumed that, given the statement "God exists.", the noncognitivist was saying something more profound that "God who?". For example, would noncognitivism be a viable position with regards to the statement: "The God of Abraham as portrayed in the Torah exists."?.

Adrian Selby · 01-28-2002, 11:14 AM

"Given the statement "X exists", what is the criteria for asserting that this statement is or is not a proposition?"

Perhaps the criteria are determined by the potential for X to be observed or otherwise coherently understood. In other words, it is a valid proposition ( I assume by proposition you mean valid) if I can conceive of how I could test it for truth or falsity.

Well, that's a start.

Adrian

Theophage · 01-28-2002, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ReasonableDoubt:
For example, would noncognitivism be a viable position with regards to the statement: "The God of Abraham as portrayed in the Torah exists."?.

Though I am not a non-cognitivist and I cannot speak for them, I would say no; the statment you gave is specific enough to call a proposition. (and it's false :^)

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01-28-2002, 11:14 AM	#4
Adrian Selby Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Farnham, UK Posts: 859	"Given the statement "X exists", what is the criteria for asserting that this statement is or is not a proposition?" Perhaps the criteria are determined by the potential for X to be observed or otherwise coherently understood. In other words, it is a valid proposition ( I assume by proposition you mean valid) if I can conceive of how I could test it for truth or falsity. Well, that's a start. Adrian

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