Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Whispers · 07-21-2003, 04:36 AM

what are your thoughts on the power of believing in God.

Try and forget for a second whether or not God exists, and tell me how belief in something can make such a difference to someones life?

For example you read of the hopeless alcoholic, who tried everything and failed to beat his addiction, and then when he "found" christ he changed.....you hear of the hugelky obese woman that cannot diet and then becomes a believer and finds the strength to do it.

I know there is another side to this, and that believing in God can also lead to much cruelty and intolerance......I cannot imagine that believing in fairies at the bottom of the garden could affect someones life one way or the other that much.....know what I mean?

What is it about the power of believing in a God, that can so change or effect us, almost like nothing else can?

Could it be because he/she exists?

scumble · 07-21-2003, 04:46 AM

Surely you can do better than that?

Whispers · 07-21-2003, 04:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by scumble
Surely you can do better than that?

Thanks for your comment!

Was that not intellectual or logical enough for you?

scumble · 07-21-2003, 05:11 AM

You posed a weighted question.
As it is, you acknowledged that belief in God can turn people in both directions, so the benefit is not apparent.
Cetain events that happen in life need not be brought by a God in order for it to provoke a change. Even if you believe they are, would it make you more likely to change?

You've produced something quite vague and emotional, not intellectual or logical.

Darth Dane · 07-21-2003, 05:19 AM

Power of the subconcious mind by JD murphy is very insightful to this question

DD - Love & Laughter

Whispers · 07-21-2003, 05:25 AM

True, True...

Although my questions have emotional content, emotions are still valid as an experience and as a way of gaining insight....

Are we not to discuss these types of issue because they are subjective? Must we relegate all of these issues of the heart to the wastebin, because I cannot prove to you what I am saying? Can a subjective experience not be discussed openly and honestly?

Love cannot be measured in any way shape or form, and IF you have not experienced it, than maybe you believe it does not exist? But it does, doesn�t it? See what I mean?

There is something VERY powerfull about the possibility of a creator being....how many hours have YOU all spent debating this very issue. It drives us, seperates us and leaves us in awe. I just want to know why such a question and decisions to that question, can effect us so greatly.....

It is unlike any other question....

Jobar · 07-21-2003, 06:10 AM

Whispers, I'm often asked, if I don't believe in God, then why do I spend so much of my time discussing the idea?

In our society, ultimates, absolutes, are most often discussed in theological terms. When beginnings and endings are the subject, God instantly comes to mind.

It's these absolute concepts that fascinate me. Oh, I'm interested in the sociological and psychological aspects of God-belief, but what keeps me here through the umpteenth discussion of Free Will and other such (to me) worn-out ideas, is the occasional nugget of wisdom about infinity.

Our world has so many people dedicated to the idea that God exists; IMO we need some dedicated to the idea that no Gods exist. I'm one of 'em.

markfiend · 07-21-2003, 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Whispers
...I cannot imagine that believing in fairies at the bottom of the garden could affect someones life one way or the other that much...

Well, a belief in fairies made two girls famous and nearly destroyed Arthur Conan Doyle's reputation. I think that's affecting someone's life...

If you have no idea what I'm talking about, look at the case of the Cottingley Fairies

Stephen T-B · 07-21-2003, 06:52 AM

We give our gods reality to the same extent that we give Justice, Injustice and Tuesday reality.

In the abstract they are meaningless, but ask the person who was acquitted of a crime he didn�t commit if there is such a thing as justice.
Ask the person who was condemned to death for a murder he didn�t commit if there�s such a thing as injustice.
Ask the person whose dental appointment was on Tuesday but he turned up for it on Wednesday if there�s such a thing as Tuesday.

The person who goes to war because he thinks his god told him to is giving it a reality for those whom he kills or bereaves or leaves homeless.

Abstract concepts may have effects which make them real - but they remain abstract concepts.

Whispers · 07-21-2003, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jobar

Our world has so many people dedicated to the idea that God exists; IMO we need some dedicated to the idea that no Gods exist. I'm one of 'em.

Can I ask why?

07-21-2003, 04:36 AM	#1
Whispers Regular Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Drawing Closer to God inch by inch... Posts: 179	just the thought alone, can change someone.... what are your thoughts on the power of believing in God. Try and forget for a second whether or not God exists, and tell me how belief in something can make such a difference to someones life? For example you read of the hopeless alcoholic, who tried everything and failed to beat his addiction, and then when he "found" christ he changed.....you hear of the hugelky obese woman that cannot diet and then becomes a believer and finds the strength to do it. I know there is another side to this, and that believing in God can also lead to much cruelty and intolerance......I cannot imagine that believing in fairies at the bottom of the garden could affect someones life one way or the other that much.....know what I mean? What is it about the power of believing in a God, that can so change or effect us, almost like nothing else can? Could it be because he/she exists?

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

07-21-2003, 04:46 AM	#2
scumble Regular Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: UK Posts: 279	Surely you can do better than that?

07-21-2003, 05:11 AM	#4
scumble Regular Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: UK Posts: 279	You posed a weighted question. As it is, you acknowledged that belief in God can turn people in both directions, so the benefit is not apparent. Cetain events that happen in life need not be brought by a God in order for it to provoke a change. Even if you believe they are, would it make you more likely to change? You've produced something quite vague and emotional, not intellectual or logical.

07-21-2003, 05:19 AM	#5
Darth Dane Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Required Posts: 2,349	Power of the subconcious mind by JD murphy is very insightful to this question DD - Love & Laughter

07-21-2003, 05:25 AM	#6
Whispers Regular Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Drawing Closer to God inch by inch... Posts: 179	True, True... Although my questions have emotional content, emotions are still valid as an experience and as a way of gaining insight.... Are we not to discuss these types of issue because they are subjective? Must we relegate all of these issues of the heart to the wastebin, because I cannot prove to you what I am saying? Can a subjective experience not be discussed openly and honestly? Love cannot be measured in any way shape or form, and IF you have not experienced it, than maybe you believe it does not exist? But it does, doesn�t it? See what I mean? There is something VERY powerfull about the possibility of a creator being....how many hours have YOU all spent debating this very issue. It drives us, seperates us and leaves us in awe. I just want to know why such a question and decisions to that question, can effect us so greatly..... It is unlike any other question....

07-21-2003, 06:10 AM	#7
Jobar Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: secularcafe.org Posts: 9,525	Whispers, I'm often asked, if I don't believe in God, then why do I spend so much of my time discussing the idea? In our society, ultimates, absolutes, are most often discussed in theological terms. When beginnings and endings are the subject, God instantly comes to mind. It's these absolute concepts that fascinate me. Oh, I'm interested in the sociological and psychological aspects of God-belief, but what keeps me here through the umpteenth discussion of Free Will and other such (to me) worn-out ideas, is the occasional nugget of wisdom about infinity. Our world has so many people dedicated to the idea that God exists; IMO we need some dedicated to the idea that no Gods exist. I'm one of 'em.

07-21-2003, 06:52 AM	#9
Stephen T-B Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Leeds, UK Posts: 5,878	We give our gods reality to the same extent that we give Justice, Injustice and Tuesday reality. In the abstract they are meaningless, but ask the person who was acquitted of a crime he didn�t commit if there is such a thing as justice. Ask the person who was condemned to death for a murder he didn�t commit if there�s such a thing as injustice. Ask the person whose dental appointment was on Tuesday but he turned up for it on Wednesday if there�s such a thing as Tuesday. The person who goes to war because he thinks his god told him to is giving it a reality for those whom he kills or bereaves or leaves homeless. Abstract concepts may have effects which make them real - but they remain abstract concepts.

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.