Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Jordan · 05-04-2002, 05:26 PM

I'm kinda clueless about a few things regarding big bang/ earth forming. This is my very basic, and probably flawed timeline.

Big Bang
Some sort of electron soup
Gravity draws atoms together, forms stars
Earth is formed
Life

This is what I don't know:

How did we get an atmosphere
How did we get water
Where did all the elements come from?

And if anyone knows some good sites that can explain this stuff to me in simple terms, I'd be very grateful

Daydreamer · 05-04-2002, 05:52 PM

Atmosphere/water:

Simple, the atoms drawn together by gravity to form the Earth weren't all solids - some were gaseous, some liquid. Through developing processes such as 'weather', and the laws of physics, water tends to be found as gas or liquid, hydrogen as a gas, etc.

Atoms:

Smaller stars make smaller atoms, large stars make large atoms. I don't know the details such as why the divisons are where they are, but the smallest of stars can fuse atoms of Hydrogen and Helium, medium stars can fuse all atoms up to Carbon, larger stars up to Iron, and the really big-ass ones can go all the way up to AN 80+.

When the stars go nova they expel their atoms, leaving them free for gravity to do its wonders.

RealityCheck · 05-04-2002, 06:23 PM

Hello Jordan,

<a href="http://www.ux1.eiu.edu/~cfjps/1400/atmos_origin.html" target="_blank">This site</a> has some info on atmosphere formation.

<a href="http://www.sprl.umich.edu/GCL/paper_to_html/universe.html" target="_blank">This site</a> explains element formation and the Big Bang.

Coragyps · 05-04-2002, 06:29 PM

Jordan: a couple of reasonable cosmology sites:
<a href="http://map.gsfc.nasa.gov/m_uni.html" target="_blank">http://map.gsfc.nasa.gov/m_uni.html</a>
<a href="http://www.astro.ucla.edu/~wright/cosmolog.htm" target="_blank">http://www.astro.ucla.edu/~wright/cosmolog.htm</a>

and there are folks here who can clarify the things you read there. Some of them here can even provide the correct answers!

As to your timeline, it's fairly significant that BB to atoms was very fast (300,000 years?), stars took 500 million years or so, and then it was a full 8000 million years until the solar system formed. The first life on Earth really was pretty soon after that, though - maybe 600 million years.

All the elements you and I are made of are, like Daydreamer said, the leftovers of dead stars - some from red giants, more from supernovae.

Bill · 05-05-2002, 06:46 AM

<a href="http://zebu.uoregon.edu/~js/ast123/" target="_blank">Professor Schombert's Astronomy 123 class, "Galaxies and the Expanding Universe"</a> is still available on the web. You can't take it for credit, of course, but the entire course is available right there on the web. It covers from even more basic stuff than what you ask, through <a href="http://zebu.uoregon.edu/~js/ast123/lectures/lec22.html" target="_blank">baryongeneiss</a> (matter formation), and into some <a href="http://zebu.uoregon.edu/~js/ast123/lectures/lec28.html" target="_blank">speculations on the future of our universe</a>. It is at an undergraduate college level, but should be comprehensible to anybody with a decent background in science (you know what "relativity" is; a brief explanation is actually part of Professor Schombert's course introduction).

== Bill

Bill · 05-05-2002, 06:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Coragyps:
<strong>All the elements you and I are made of are, like Daydreamer said, the leftovers of dead stars - some from red giants, more from supernovae. </strong>

One of the most memorable (to me) moments of <a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000055ZOB/qid=thesecularweb/" target="_blank">Carl Sagan's Cosmos series</a> was where he explained that, ending with the line:

Quote:

We are star stuff.

== Bill

05-05-2002, 07:09 AM

Richard Feynmann (a physicist) and Richard Dawkins (especially his fascinating and challenging book The extended Phenotype)

Jordan · 05-05-2002, 09:57 PM

Thanks everyone. The reason I was asking is because my high school's Christian group is having a "ask questions" day tomorrow, and my friends have asked me to go. Wish me luck!

wordsmyth · 05-06-2002, 12:26 AM

I recommend the books "A Brief History of Time" and "The Universe In A Nutshell" both by Stephen Hawking

-=Vagrant=- · 05-06-2002, 08:58 AM

Hello!

As a newbie I'd like to ask what would be the best way to test someone's paranormal ability. The ability is called MIMD. He claims to have the ability to influence boxers performance in fights. His test seem to be un-scientific. That someone is AForce1, he proves the paranormal here: <a href="http://www.unexplainedphenomenon.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=experiments" target="_blank">http://www.unexplainedphenomenon.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=experiments</a>

Thank you in advance.

05-04-2002, 05:26 PM	#1
Jordan Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: New Zealand Posts: 13	Newbie Questions I'm kinda clueless about a few things regarding big bang/ earth forming. This is my very basic, and probably flawed timeline. Big Bang Some sort of electron soup Gravity draws atoms together, forms stars Earth is formed Life This is what I don't know: How did we get an atmosphere How did we get water Where did all the elements come from? And if anyone knows some good sites that can explain this stuff to me in simple terms, I'd be very grateful

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05-04-2002, 05:52 PM	#2
Daydreamer Regular Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Diego Posts: 221	Atmosphere/water: Simple, the atoms drawn together by gravity to form the Earth weren't all solids - some were gaseous, some liquid. Through developing processes such as 'weather', and the laws of physics, water tends to be found as gas or liquid, hydrogen as a gas, etc. Atoms: Smaller stars make smaller atoms, large stars make large atoms. I don't know the details such as why the divisons are where they are, but the smallest of stars can fuse atoms of Hydrogen and Helium, medium stars can fuse all atoms up to Carbon, larger stars up to Iron, and the really big-ass ones can go all the way up to AN 80+. When the stars go nova they expel their atoms, leaving them free for gravity to do its wonders.

05-04-2002, 06:23 PM	#3
RealityCheck Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 50	Hello Jordan, <a href="http://www.ux1.eiu.edu/~cfjps/1400/atmos_origin.html" target="_blank">This site</a> has some info on atmosphere formation. <a href="http://www.sprl.umich.edu/GCL/paper_to_html/universe.html" target="_blank">This site</a> explains element formation and the Big Bang.

05-04-2002, 06:29 PM	#4
Coragyps Veteran Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Snyder,Texas,USA Posts: 4,411	Jordan: a couple of reasonable cosmology sites: <a href="http://map.gsfc.nasa.gov/m_uni.html" target="_blank">http://map.gsfc.nasa.gov/m_uni.html</a> <a href="http://www.astro.ucla.edu/~wright/cosmolog.htm" target="_blank">http://www.astro.ucla.edu/~wright/cosmolog.htm</a> and there are folks here who can clarify the things you read there. Some of them here can even provide the correct answers! As to your timeline, it's fairly significant that BB to atoms was very fast (300,000 years?), stars took 500 million years or so, and then it was a full 8000 million years until the solar system formed. The first life on Earth really was pretty soon after that, though - maybe 600 million years. All the elements you and I are made of are, like Daydreamer said, the leftovers of dead stars - some from red giants, more from supernovae.

05-05-2002, 06:46 AM	#5
Bill Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Gatorville, Florida Posts: 4,334	<a href="http://zebu.uoregon.edu/~js/ast123/" target="_blank">Professor Schombert's Astronomy 123 class, "Galaxies and the Expanding Universe"</a> is still available on the web. You can't take it for credit, of course, but the entire course is available right there on the web. It covers from even more basic stuff than what you ask, through <a href="http://zebu.uoregon.edu/~js/ast123/lectures/lec22.html" target="_blank">baryongeneiss</a> (matter formation), and into some <a href="http://zebu.uoregon.edu/~js/ast123/lectures/lec28.html" target="_blank">speculations on the future of our universe</a>. It is at an undergraduate college level, but should be comprehensible to anybody with a decent background in science (you know what "relativity" is; a brief explanation is actually part of Professor Schombert's course introduction). == Bill

05-05-2002, 07:09 AM	#7
Synaesthesia Guest Posts: n/a	Richard Feynmann (a physicist) and Richard Dawkins (especially his fascinating and challenging book The extended Phenotype)

05-05-2002, 09:57 PM	#8
Jordan Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: New Zealand Posts: 13	Thanks everyone. The reason I was asking is because my high school's Christian group is having a "ask questions" day tomorrow, and my friends have asked me to go. Wish me luck!

05-06-2002, 12:26 AM	#9
wordsmyth Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Des Moines, Ia. U.S.A. Posts: 521	I recommend the books "A Brief History of Time" and "The Universe In A Nutshell" both by Stephen Hawking

05-06-2002, 08:58 AM	#10
-=Vagrant=- Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Here and there Posts: 11	Hello! As a newbie I'd like to ask what would be the best way to test someone's paranormal ability. The ability is called MIMD. He claims to have the ability to influence boxers performance in fights. His test seem to be un-scientific. That someone is AForce1, he proves the paranormal here: <a href="http://www.unexplainedphenomenon.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=experiments" target="_blank">http://www.unexplainedphenomenon.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=experiments</a> Thank you in advance.

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