ManM

If God is omnipotent, then everything that happens must be in accordance with His will. How then could human freedom of will be anything more than an illusion?

Or we could look at it another way... God cannot be omnipotent if we have the freedom to act in a way opposed to His will. And so, when the theist uses a free will defense, he is actually arguing against the omnipotence of God.

Could an omnipotent being create something which is outside his power? This is just a sophisticated way to ask whether he could create a rock heavier than he could lift. If we say that he could, then we are left with an interesting scenario. God creates man with free will. At the moment of this creation, God is no longer omnipotent. God has no power over human will, and hence evil independent of God becomes a possibility. How then could such a God fight against such an evil?

Seeker196

The simpler explanation is that maybe the idea of an 'omnipotent being' doesn't make very much sense...

sighhswolf

Very well put Seeker, I agree with your assertion.
The attempt of christian theologians to define the nature of their god by assigning attributes such as "omnipotent" is a ruse to get around the "incomprehensible".
Wolf

Hugh Jass

Well yes, as soon as 'omnipotence' is mentioned any discussion is stillborn since the idea is paradoxical in itself.
'Can God make a rock so heavy he can't lift it?'

ManM

Erm, I'm really looking for a good 'what if' game. "Can God make a rock so heavy he can't lift it?" I'm contemplating the consequences if we answer "yes". Any thoughts?

Vorkosigan

Well, He is a Trinity, so maybe if God makes the rock, Jesus can lift it....

Amos

You should be able to answer that yourself because you are the one who created the image of the god you have in mind.

Our God is the God of the living and does not run a quarry.

Captain Pedantic

My thought was always about Satan. Presumably, God can see into the future. So God knows what will happen if a certain path is taken. So God knew that Lucifer would go bad and attempt mutiny. So why create Lucifer?

Did God want evil, terror, temptation etc to be unleashed into the world? Why? Is God not actually very nice?

If God didn't know Lucifer would do that, I don't think he's much of a god, frankly.

Bree

I always thought that 'goddidit' in order to weed out the weak from the holy.

As far as free-will goes...my parents always explained to me that God has a master plan for your life. That plan consists of a series of points - you're supposed to go from point A to point B. Free-will comes into play when you choose to take a detour from the point-A-to-B route and go to point C instead. Inevitably (this is what I was told) you will end up at point B, it's just that you have decided how long it takes to get there.

BS? I think so.

Brian63

The whole free will/omnimax attributes is a complicated issue, but as far as my understanding goes, I do not agree with this above assertion. Omnipotence, I believe, means simply that God has the ability to exercise any logically possible activity, it does not mean that he actually does, however.



This is still wrong though, IMO. God could have given us free will, but I don't see how that means he is not omnipotent, if that's what you're getting at. You're Christian aren't you, ManM?



Even if the answer is "no," it does not follow that God actually exercises his power over people at all times.

Brian [/Christian's advocate]